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[I literally can't bear it. I'm now on a disability pension (for mental health issues) and I worry constantly about money, do things like groping around in the dark to save on power and often feel distressed in the night
My parents were calling me insane from adolescence onwards and I believed them, even though I did well academically and was popular with teachers and other pupils.

Dear Southbound,
I am so sorry you're feeling so low. My parents used to say very similar things to me and I too believed them. I have suffered crippling anxiety and sometimes depression too, and unfortunately these emotional states contributed to create my fibromyalgia and very early arthritis that have been very hard to bear in the last 20 years.

I have had many problems with work as the result of all this.

Only now I have come to understand that my parents made me the scapegoat of the family, and that they were WRONG. I wish very sincerely that you come to see your abusers as wrong too.

I hope that being here will make you feel more cared for and respected, despite this being an online group only.

Hello!

I also wish to say 'thank you' to Spryte for the clear explanation of the many myths on forgiveness. These myths, like 'having to forgive for us, not for them', are clearly re-victimizations for us, who have had to suffer the original trauma.

And as far as I am concerned, I don't even understand what they mean with it. I feel anger at my abusers, but I am more and more at peace with myself when I put the responsibility for the abuse on them, not me. And I used to feel guilty for 'not being able to forgive' in the past.

I still feel sorry for my abusers occasionally. I tell myself that maybe they 'didn't know how to do it better'... but then I tell myself that I have enough with dealing with the consequences of the abuse every day of my life.

Just my little contribution to this tread.

I don't wish my Narents ill and I don't wish my them well, either. I just don't wish them to be a part of my life, that's all. --- And I don't even feel guilty about that. I deserve to concentrate on myself and my FOC and allow myself to heal and grow.

Well said KF! 

I agree! My parents are both dead. My mother was the 'main abuser' but my father abandoned me in her hands, never stuck up for me.
It is easy for society to judge us... us who somehow gained the courage to look after ourselves, and see things for what they are. If others choose to remain blind, I see no reason to accompany them in their way down!

So my question is - I'm quite happy not having my parents in my life. I am ok with never talking to my family again.  Is it ok to do this?  Is it ok to not forgive?

It's about [i
Wholeheartedly: Yes, it's ok!
]you[/i] and what's best for you. 

I think it's important to do whatever it takes to get the feelings of 'bitterness' (for want of a better word; English is not my first language) or any other feelings that might be holding you back  from present or future progress - but I emphatically do not believe that absolving your f of his hurtful behaviour is in any way neccessary to your own recovery.

I was raised by Narents and like you, on some level I still wish I could make them see and understand the hurt they've put me through and the impact it had and has on my life. But alas, we're truly "children of the self absorbed" and there is no way of getting through to them. So the best option is to look ahead and take the best possible care of ourselves and allow ourselves to heal.

Forgive your f inasmuch as it's neccessary for your own sake - that's all you're responsible for IMO.

Hello!

I have not forgiven my parents, and I do not believe we 'have to'. And I am not 'resentful, angry,'... etc as many think.
My main objective is to forgive myself for 'not being able to be stronger' as a child. 
My mother, too, was a narcissist. I can well imagine we have suffered a lot!

Dear all who responded,

Thank you! Your letters have given me comfort in a moment when my 'moods' have been up and down as it happens when something triggers them (even if I don't know what this 'something' might be).

Bee, I too have great difficulty in calling my 'M' mother. Looking back I can see that I've never beenable to love her, not even in my childhood. She was always cruel and dictatorial, very arrogant (she was a narcissist) and caused me great pain because I could feel, somehow, that she was NOT as my friends' mothers were. For example, my positive mother figure was Grandma, who lived with us, and provided blessed support and love to me. I wanted to be with her only, and perhaps with Dad sometimes when the M wasn't around. But it didn't happen too often.

In my culture of origin (Latin America, I haven't lived there for 35 years and am an Australian now), the mother was unfortunately glorified. She had all rights and I was told she should be 'everything' for me. So, my engulfing M got everyone on her side when I complained anywhere. Your parents had ALL rights over children, especially daughters. Short of killing them, they could do as they pleased. So, I had NO support whatsoever, and shouldn't have been for my blessed grandma only God knows what would I have become.

The story of all these events that took place long ago is, however, still with me. I have improved over the years with counselling, all sort of readings to help and a fierce determination to 'get over it', but I still need help, I still isolate myself and I still feel pain and shame. That's perhaps de worst: shame.

I was so shamed about everything that I have to make a conscious effort, every day, to catch myself when I start going 'down that track again'. And it is tiring.

Throughout the years I developed fibromyalgia and early osteoarthritis, and I live with chronic pain. This adds to my tiredness, and many times I have to cancel events in the evening because my body aches all over. This isn't easily understood by many, so I've lost friends especially because I don't know how to explain myself, I feel ashamed to have to explain my illness... perhaps I feel that I 'should have got over it by know'

No, I haven't forgiven my M for all this. That isn't my priority. My priority is just to live through each day, with the consequences of all this that happened to me. Mmmmm.... difficult, hey!

Dear Apples,
Don't ever think that we will be 'sick of you' or anything like this!
I am very sorry about your parents, and their lack of support and understanding. And about your brother as well. You're NOT to blame for any of this, and I am truly sorry this happened to you. Nobody deserves to be treated like this.

My mother was very abusive to me and my father was in thrall of her and either was distant during my childhood or acted in 'funny' ways as well. I, too, was treated very unfairly and was made the scapegoat of the family. During my adolescence my mother was truly envious of me and made my life miserable.

So, you see, we all have had difficult families here. Please feel free to keep talking.

I am new too though I have had therapy and worked very hard throughout the years to undo my family's damage. I have accepted this is a lifelong task though we do get better.

Welcome and keep posting. 

And yet more to tell. (I haven't received any reply, but I know more than 40 read this)

Reading about another member sexual abuse brought out this issue I have never been able to clarify (so far).

I have just an image of seeing a male's genitals when I was in a somewhat 'hiding' place at home, (under the main staircase), when I was just 2 or 3 years old. (We lived in a really big house with plenty of out of the way places). As a child, I used those spaces to play and I liked the privacy there) specially one under the big staircase, where the phone was located.

I just 'see' the male genitals, which smelt 'not too good' and the 'memory' stops there (If it was a memory and not 'imagination).
And when I 'remember' this, I somehow 'think' of two male employees of my parents' for some reason.

These employees were apparently ok. Or at least, I didn't get to know of anything wrong with them. But I do know that when I was possibly 6-7 y o I was scared of those stairs especially at night, to the point that if I had to go to the toilet in the evening I would seek my grandmother, who lived with us and was the only sunshine of my young life, to accompany me.

Re: my fears, by that time I was attending a Nuns' school and preparing for first communion (and no, I'm NOT  a catholic any more now). In those days children were very indoctrinated about the devil in catholic schools, and mine was no exception. So most children were fearful of the 'evil one' who was always ready -the nuns said- to carry you to *.

I really wonder what was going on there. As a clarification, I don't have any brothers or sisters, and my father, despite being very insensitive with me, don't seem to me like having anything to do with this. He could have had many shortcomings, but this kind doesn't feel like him at all.

Any input? It could be welcome indeed.

More about this topic.

My mother was a rage full and deceitful person who thought nothing of lying and 'listen' to me when trying to get information about my life; later, she would use that same information against me.
This happened particularly during my adolescence, when she realized that I was not telling her all.

Mother thought nothing of talking behind my back, even to my dearest girlfriends, painting herself as a 'poor victim' of me, 'when all she wanted to do was to be a loving mom'. A couple of my friends even fell for it, in a culture who had many stereotyped beliefs about mothers (like they could do no wrong, loved their children and made great sacrifices for them, et al). I lost some friends because of these 'talks', which still can cause me pain when I remember these things.

When I confronted mother with her interference in my private life, she would either deny it or rage at me, calling me an 'ungrateful daughter' after all she 'had done for me'. If I didn't back down and 'apologize' she called my father and enlisted him in punishing me.

Mother never thought that to look after a sick child is a parent's responsibility. She denied it when I confronted her with the way she had parented me when I was sick; namely: put me in bed and then throw a 'barrage' at me for, somehow, 'being to blame for my illness'. (I 'ate something she told me not to, or went outside when it was too hot or too cold', et al).

I have read in recovery forums that many abusive parents use the same arguments and even words throughout the world. They may even talk different languages but somehow they're all very similar. It is as if they all have had the same 'school' and they have 'learned' their lessons very well.

I was assigned the family role of scapegoat. Everything that went wrong or my parents disliked was, somehow, my fault. My parents had an extremely volatile relationship between them, despite my father being in thrall of mom. But they couldn't negotiate anything between them without ending up insulting and screaming at each other. However, there was always ONE thing that always united them: they were always in perfect agreement to discharge their foulest tempers at me; they were always ready to believe the worst when it came to anything about me. In my adolescence and early adulthood, I was accused of the most outlandish deeds. Even after so many years I cannot even imagine where they got those ideas that definitely, had nothing at all to do with my personality.

There is still so much more to go, but getting into all this causes me pain and I need to rest. I can only speak so much in a day or setting.

I did have a couple of similar therapists. One of them, on the other hand, I may qualify as a neglectful/abuser, even.
She was a couples counsellor who took my ex's side openly against me. I finally got up and left -forever- in the middle of a session.

The 'blank-screen therapist, on the other hand,' is completely inappropriate for people who are c-ptsd survivors like us. And in my opinion, those who try to apply their values, principles and morality to their counselling are very useless and even dangerous to us too.

 When I think of my childhood I see it as 'weird'. Even when I now know many others who have suffered at the hands of those who should have loved them best -parents of course- I still feel that mine was somehow 'different', strange, as if I went through the strangest experience of all.

I feel overwhelmed when I want to talk about it and I don't know where to start.
Maybe talking about my father, who was the 'neglectful' one whilst my mother had more the role of abuser.

My childhood was plagued by illness. I see why now. My mother was livid with that, though she said, to her dying day, that I 'owed not to be a health wreck like I was destined to be, because of her loving care'... I still feel sick in my stomach when I remember that.
Mother used my childhood illnesses to deprive me of many foods (without any medical advice), especially 'treats' like chocolate, cakes and the like.

Father, who talked to friends and family of how difficult life was since my birth, and how a heavy burden my illnesses were, did nevertheless something very odd from time to time, namely: he took me on outings with him (like going  shopping for something), and bought me chocolate and treats, but making it very clear that I should never, ever, tell my mother about it!!!

This sort of weird behaviour continued throughout my young years, and not once, after those 'forbidden foods' did I get sick. That is, in my stomach; I don't really know about my emotions.

I grew up loving my father and being furious with him at the same time. I just couldn't understand why he just couldn't stand up for me, and tell my mother the truth about my health.
Perhaps I am not very sure if I understand his behaviour now. He was a very cultured man, who read a lot and could have great conversations on almost anything. And at the same time he was completely narrow minded when it came to certain matters, such as women rights and especially daughter's needs and rights.
However, he was in thrall of my mother, who dictated her whims to almost everyone, and was prone to extreme rages and emotional abuse. My mother was a narcissist and I believe she also had traces of borderline personality disorder. But this will be another post.

If I am still confused and not very coherent, please understand that, despite years of therapies (some useful and some much less than that), I still feel like a little girl inside when I start talking of these topics. Thanks for 'listening' anyway!

  Thanks to everyone who welcome me here. You're very kind and I appreciate it.
I am just trying to find words to express a few things that have been going around in my head but then I find 'no words' or I feel that I don't know where to start.
So, maybe I will keep reading and replying to http://outofthefog.net/C-PTSD/forum/Smileys/classic/stars.gifposts until I can get my own firs
Again, thanks to you all!

Hello Cat,
and a big thank you! I can see in your words that many others think like me... or feel like me perhaps is a better way to put it!

Speak about minimizing and trivializing! I live in Australia now but was born into another culture, where parents had all rights on children and, short of killing us, they could do as they pleased.

My parents were very abusive and neglectful. Mother was a narcissist who of course refused to acknowledge ANY wrongdoing. Father was in thrall of her, despite living like cat and dog. And I was the scapegoat. They only joined together in agreement when it came to decide how 'an ungrateful daughter' I was. You know what I mean.

Well, I'm having a flashback right now so I will stop for now.

Thank you again,

Gabrielle

Hi there,
I am new here, my name is Gabrielle and I suffer cptsd.

I recently read a book by Pete Walker named 'Complex ptsd: from surviving to thriving'. It really impacted me as I have had an emotionally and psychologically abusive childhood with parents very similar to many described in the book. It validated me to find written there, many truths I always knew where inside me but never allowed myself to believe I might be right after all!

I have had therapy for many years. Sometimes helpful and sometimes better left out. This is an onion with many layers, and I've also been my own therapist by reading many self-help books throughout the years. It seems however, that this is a lifetime battle, so here I am, still following my path and trying to hook up with fellow travellers.

I hope are mutual journey is for the benefit of everyone involved. 

Cheers!

Gabrielle