Messages

 

San, thank you so much for that! That means a lot to hear. I guess it is really all anyone can do-get away. I think "normal" people have it engrained that their family is the foundation for not believing what these people have to say. I imagine someone with support would think, "what's YOUR problem, **? But for us, the sting is because their words confirm what our parents have been telling us, or the message they've sent through actions, all along. It feels like mere strangers can see the "defects" our parents have been trying to tell us!

The only think I could have done a little better is left sooner, and maybe said something, but still, was only there a few minutes. Funnily, I felt "rude" if I left before I finished the beer he bought me. That's a little disturbing to me, but I think I did make some progress there. I think in the past I would have stuck around, perhaps trying to gain some approval before he really went for the jugular.

It still is surprising to me that there are actually predators out there doing these things. And why were these others at the table his friend? I can't imagine anyone tolerating him for long.

Libby, I hadn't been meeting people or interacting much with strangers since my lightbulb moment and research about NPD, going NC with some family, and really understanding why I've attracted and tried to stay with the men I have in the past. I got to thinking as the day went on, WOW, I have not mastered my boundaries at all, and must have the same vibe as before. ACK. Not a nice feeling. As for him, he's simply one of those N's on the prowl and I guess picked up on it. It's weird because I wasn't even doing anything but unlocking my bike when he approached me.

ah, I think you're spot on. It's funny you said he was bored, because after a few minutes, that's exactly what he said! Amongst other things. We were all drinking so that fed into the situation. I would have never sat down with them otherwise.

The thing is, I have quite a few british friends who I have played soccer with and who are close friends. One wasn't there but at work, but I was there to cheer on england by myself. I have lived and worked abroad and made many friends. My true friends have remained over the years, several of whom are brits. Yet this guy managed to tell me brits would not like me, my personality. (Wow, mother much?) It's funny he says that because my friends who are british say the opposite, but they choose to actually "see" me.

As I thought it through, I remembered some of the things I've learned in the past couple of years. I'm usually focused on solving the Nm conundrum, but I realize the men I've picked "ARE" my Nm in male form. If anyone can criticize the things I care about most, and not see the real me, it's my mother. I've read where PD's are uncanny at seeing what would hurt you and pushing the right buttons. Wow, this guy sure did. He didn't see me at all, and then criticized and mocked the time and energy I was giving him (10-15 minutes? lol) I guess it was simply an example of what the material Iv'e read/watched is talking about to beware of! He was testing me to see if he could get to me, and while he did internally, I don't think I let it show. I think I could have said something, but at least I left with my dignity in tact and wasn't an * in return. He wouldn't have cared what I said.

Lesson learned. Yeah, I am timid and usually stay home with this stuff, but I got out there on my own and did something, and it was fun up until then. I did meet some seemingly nice people who invited me out for next match. So, are they nice? Do they have some other motive? Who knows? I guess I can just go and have my antennas up. But they seemed alright.

Ugh. I'm replying to myself. So, i know intellectually it's all projections. Who knows who this guy is or why. It doesn't even matter. What doeos concern me is out of the hundreds of people in the place, why does this person magnetize to me, ask me to join his group for a drink, and then proceed to covertly put me down? And when he did, I knew he was being an * but I didn't react. I just froze, and then a few minutes later said well thanks for the drink, nice to meet you all, and left. I felt like I successfully didn't give the reaction he may have been looking for, but then again, he managed to say a couple of things that struck me deeply. It's kind of like thinking the vibe I give off is a turn-off, dorky, weird, or something. His comments confirmed that.

So, out at a pub to see world cup. eventually a brit asked me to join his group for a drink. proceeded to be total *. I'm familiar with this scenario. Don't take it personally. However, how did he manage to say a couple of things that really pushed my buttons? Really hurt. This is the very thing that discourages me from getting out and meeting people. Although I know he is just an *, why does it bother me? And how did I manage to attract this type. It's really frustrating- a set back.

Yeah, it really is. Thanks for the validation, too. I think the less expectations the better, but in the midst of it, it's hurtful still. I can't imagine not being hurt by it. We need our dads to be dads and for some reason they don't see that.

Boats, I just wanted to say I can so relate to everything you said. I tend to think of my dad as the enabler, but he is also N like this. It's hard to see others' dads being supportive, taking an interest. And these callous responses are what we get. My dad's thing lately is he says he's going to call at a certain time and doesn't. Maybe a week or two later he'll get around to it. And then says "don't be mad at me" when he finally calls. I just said, " I already have learned that when you say you'll call you don't, so if I have that expectation it would be my own fault." Then he just doesn't respond.

I've really learned a lot on here in all areas of trying to recover and become aware of the dynamics. I'm NC with Nm, and VLC/MC with dad. I can't trust them. I love my dad but I can't trust him and heaven knows I can't rely on him to be a dad.

Ugh. I'll try to be brief. Just spent time with GCs and nephews. Long story short, the denial and lack of reality is creating two monsters. It is mind-boggling, and the way she treats ME when they are behaving badly is infuriating. I literally am alive because of wanting to be in their lives and leave them with a good and positive legacy from their aunt. Right now after a vacation together, I feel like there is no one left I can relate to anymore. They are living and playing out their dysfunction because GCs refuses to learn about the dynamic-refuses to delve into it about our Nm because that would mean facing it and likely losing a baby sitter. I can't see this situation getting better because the kids have learned how to manipulate and it works for them. They do what they want, throw every kind of tantrum, do the opposite of what was asked, lie, and the adults are expected to scurry behind picking up after them and sacrificing their peace and good time because of the kids, with never one consequence to the kids. In earlier childhood they were spanked every two seconds, and now they never have a consequence. I don't get it and as you can see I am feeling pretty hopeless. There is no way I'm spending my vacations with my ONLY family like this again. 

Thank you, Rowan. That means a lot.  So sorry you experienced such intrusive disrespect of your boundaries by the very ones who are supposed to be supportive. 

Thanks, Deep Blue. There's been so many times I froze. I usually do freeze, or fawn. I'm trying to get better about believing my opinion matters too, and if people are going to bring stuff like that up, at a fun lunch no less, than I feel like I deserve a say (finally). Although this is hard for me and I'll be working on this for a long time, I'm sure.

Also, above, I did not intend to offend about the addictive and denial issues. Those are some of my issues (alcohol, eating, denial) which after realizing and coming out of the fog about this, it's easy to see in myself, and in others who have the same type of issues.

Bria- I have a few of those "i was spanked and turned out fine" or, "spanking taught me to respect my elders", etc.. The people in my life who say this also have a plethora of denial issues going on. They are "fine", yet alcoholic, or morbidly obese, horde, or have emotional issues that are undeniable. The spanking did them good, but what made them have addiction, ocd and/or denial then? (I want to ask but don't) I don't buy the "it taught me respect". It taught a lot of things, but respect was not one of them.

In a letter I got from my Nm after going NC (one where she tried to hoover and manipulate of course) she said she thought she needed to "discipline" me to "teach me how to treat people." Yes, to "treat" her in the sadistic way she required. Full and immediate compliance in every situation, and if half a second goes by it's full retaliation by way of hitting, beating and screaming. So she basically confirmed it was wrong, while trying to defend her actions and turn it around on me once more.

I had a recent lunch with my best friend's mom and sister the other day, and they started "joking" about spanking and how they used switches and pink pong paddles and how the kids would try to hide them. I was really triggered and I said I didn't agree with spanking or hitting of any kind. They got real quiet, then defended themselves and laughed it off. I felt a chilly frost when we parted ways and I though "GOOD". I can't listening to all that stuff anymore without saying something. I guess that's a step in the right direction.

very well said, sadie

Yes, I can so relate. I have been a bit focused on this thought lately as well. Generally the message is "it's never to late to start a new life!" Well, it is too late to start the life I WANTED and had the potential to create! Sure, I can change directions and make things better, include some hobbies I enjoy, etc. Be satisfied for being as fortunate as I am.

But I do get resentful and SAD that the very things I had potential of excelling at have always been sabotaged, from an early age through early adulthood. I was berated and belittled for my interests. I was told to get my head out of my * (As a young child) for being interested in music and art. I was not allowed to do things that were perceived as what "a boy would do" by my mother, so that eliminated the rest of my interests (my sport, skateboarding). If it cost any money or time spent taking me somewhere, it was an automatic no. If she could tie danger into it, she would use that as a reason as well. She just didn't want me to excel.

Now I'm almost 52. What am I going to do? Start a career in music? No, but I learn and play for a hobby. And the younger people, and teachers, are all amazing, and have wonderful supportive parents, I notice. It's kind of a trigger for me, when I see how free and confident they are, and see them interacting with their parents, who are so kind, supportive and respectful of their grown kids (even the 18 year olds get respect).

I worked in the teaching realm for most of my adult life. However, I really struggled with relationships- coworkers, students, bosses. Especially in 20's and 30's. Now I work from home online, hidden away with reduced interpersonal stress. I see now why it was like this.

I could go hop on a skateboard or try out for a team, if I want to break an ankle! But, I settle for appreciating being active and able to do physical activity in some capacity. I had the potential to play at the highest level. At least try out. But I was disallowed. Back then in your 20's you were considered too old. I was often told I was too old for this that and the other by my mom. Too old to go to college at age 24. And I felt shame and ridiculous for wanting to go at such an old age. I was really brainwashed.

So, I do feel for you and understand. I'm really mad at myself for not "rebelling" and just doing my thing once I left home, but in hindsight, I was extremely brainwashed and extremely trauma bonded. Her plan worked I guess.

 

I sure am glad you found and got the cancer removed and are healing! That is good to hear!

Deep- I do enjoy making art although I haven't done it in about 5 years. I'm trying to take some time now to fiddle and get back into making things. Painting mostly, and mosaic are things I really like. Art is one of those things that I was criticized about wanting to do, minimized and not accepted. It's something I've struggled with, and I think in a sense I "gave up" without knowing it. I just got tired of it being sort of a frustration. I've had time to become a prolific and well-established artist, and the ability, but I didn't, and I'm mad at myself because of it. It's because of this I feel like Nm "won." So, now I'm just starting over with play and nothing serious or whatever. Art should just be a joy, not a burden. I would love to turn it around and it be something that can help heal me and maybe help others with that.

San-omg, my Nm has hurled so many of these things at me throughout life, and unfortunately it caused a LOT of cognitive dissonance. I actually believed her in a sense and went along with it, only to be very frustrated on the inside. In my 20's I would say I had rage inside, although I never showed it. I don't feel that anymore, but nothing can bring up anger faster than someone dismissing my pain. I don't want to go around in pain and devoid of feeling whole anymore. I just don't know how to fully get there. When my Nm and I had the "conversation" that let me know I could not go back, and basically had no choice but NC, it was like a part of me was amputated. And now I feel like, maybe I became whole for once and just didn't know it. Maybe amputating the abuse was the key to moving forward.

Thank you all for your support and encouragement! You help tremendously!