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Thank you Hope, and again to you woodsgnome. My journey is much better with you guys in it. Sab

Hi Bach, I'm glad to hear you're doing well with this. sab.

Hello woodsgnome, those feelings you talk about have such deep roots that it feels sometimes foolish to even try. I second what everyone else has said here, just wanted you to know that I heard you too. I like so much what owl25 said..." I think the truth is that we can't logic our way out of our wounds, and they need to be met with presence, love and care. We can do this with the help of another human being who knows how to do this."   

blues_cruise, I also have been in the position, often, of being stuck in a job that I hate, for one reason or another. I just wanted to tell you I recognise how awful it is and if it helps to affirm what an awful drain it can be on the emotions and nerves. When I started on a healing journey I left one decently paid job and rejected another, because they were definitely contributing to ill health. Each time took much soul searching. I think sometimes that being economically 'active' is promoted against all else. Obviously being here means that we know that it's not. Good luck, whatever happens.

Bach I want to thank you for sharing your letter. I hear how hard it hurts, and I recognise almost everything in it from a recent experience of mine, including shrugging off the hurt. In some ways I think this is a strength. The part about not being an equal - it's funny that I was thinking in those exact same terms this weekend about a friendship of mine. to you if it's ok.

Hi, Hope and woodsgnome,

It's funny to me how my perspective can change on these things somewhat. This weekend I finally fetched that big box from the loft and I started to burn through the old paper. I also have had some despairing moments but also some of hope and light.

I'm realising that the world might be a messed up place but it's not within my power to fix, so the best thing I can do for myself is to concentrate on helping myself, for now. Small steps and short bursts in the right direction mean that even if I am going wrong sometimes,hopefully overall I'll be going the right way. Sending hugs to you both. 

Thank you Violet Magenta, for sharing. I recognise deeply those feelings. Working on it gently is great progress. That's what I'm working at doing at the moment too.

Hi Hope, woodsgnome, and sanmagic  thank you for being here 

I'd like to write a bit about your responses. First of all thanks, every response is appreciated. I am glad that my worries about overdeveloped narcissism in myself seem to be baseless. It's good to hear everyone's thoughts on this. I think maybe I have been told in the past that I don't need to worry about this. But, sometimes, I feel like I sink a bit down and then maybe I start to look for reasons to be hard on myself.

Thank you sanmagic for what you wrote about being open and sharing and being part of your lives. It means a lot. If there is something worth sharing here then I am more than happy to share.

woodsgnome, I really recognise your struggle to avoid n. traits. The thing you wrote about appearing toward a push-over was honestly startling, because that is something I recognise in myself. I have astonished people in the past when I have kicked back against that assumption, but at the same time I must recognise that I must be showing that tendency, in some ways. It is amazing to me how much that affects my behaviour to this day, which I will write a bit more about because I want to explore that.

Hope, thank you for sharing your worries about N. Like sanmagic I have also got behind on journals, but I think that I know enough about you to know that this is something that should not be a concern for you, though I understand how it comes about.  to everyone.

Re. my thoughts, and feelings. Journaling here is I think one of the most helpful things I did and or am doing to help myself recover. When I moved house recently, I put all of my hand written notes and musings into a bix old cardboard box. That box is 3ft x 3ft x 3ft and is filled with scraps, sheets and pages of paper. It is an un-ordered mess, and this winter I will pull that box out and gradually burn everything that I've written inside. I've realised there's no way I can read it all again and hope to make sense of it. Here, at least I feel that I must try to filter things somehow and write in a way that makes sense. It's also easier to read back because the entries are kept in the order they are written. So that's all great. I do try to participate in the forum too. Anyway, I'm getting off the point of what I wanted to say.

I come from a family of pressure, bullying, and gaslighting. There were eight of us in a very small house. I know that there was also love there, but I fear that most of the love has evaporated. That is ok, I stopped looking for it. I'm 44 years old. My M was a mean, bullying emotional mess of a woman, who was also capable of expressing love in short doses. She passed away some 26 years ago. My F fell into the victim role, which became impossible for him to break from. He passed away about 4 years ago. I'm not even sure. To me he had been living a kind of death for a long time.

I don't trust people, sanmagic, because I don't know how, though I think and hope this is gradually changing. My siblings, are mixed. Some acknowledge we had a hard time and others don't. None are really capable of exploring the damage that was done. I think due to varying levels of emotional self defences and denial.

So, because I don't trust, I don't trust myself. This is true in as much as my tendancy to minimise my abuse is as prevelant in me as it is in my siblings. Because, I think, if we deny it, we don't have to deal with it, right? Wrong. Well, here at 44 I am and I am desperate not to become a clone of my father. To not only be able to function in a victim role. I don't want to minimise being a victim. I have been a victim, but I choose to let that go! If only it was that easy! That is the hard journey for me. Journaling gives me a voice that I was denied and had learned to deny myself. This must be a positive thing.

Also to learn to trust and not to expect to be punished for expressing myself, that is big. My levels of fear around this astonish me to this day because there is no-one around now who will punish me this way, but still my inner child cowers from expressing things like hope, joy, love, needs, wants - because he expects to be physically harmed for doing so.

So it is amazing to find a place, where love is allowed and accepted.  If i can learn to not do this ->  that will be wonderful. I really want the rest of my life to be healthier than my past.  How can I stop listening to that part of me that is going  and nagging me to give it up, to give in. Well, maybe that part will be with me always. I have some ideas about re-arranging the mental space that he gets.

Hi Hope,

Thank you so much, for reading my journal, and responing kindly to it too.

I like that you felt I was brave for posting that part that I did. I was very scared at the time and felt tiny. I am learning that when I feel like that there might be a strong emotion at play. Posting here feels safe, but I must admit that I was very worried when I wrote that that I may be 'exposing' myself as a bad person.

I am really re-assured by your words and by Snowdrop's. I have heard it say that a small measure of narcicissm is healthy and normal, it is only when it becomes a prime part of a person's personality that it becomes problematic. I agree with that in theory, it is just harder to incorporate all these things. Without wanting to go too deep (i feel my words getting tangled now too!),  I am starting to recognise 'parts' of myself. I have heard people talk about their parts, indeed Hope, your journal title references those, and I have longed I think in some way, to feel what those words mean. IN other words, I have not really experience 'parts' of myself. But I think that all my journal entries, and some of my posts, are indeed ways that I have been processing this, maybe not conciously but on a level of thought that I can't easily access from 'myself'. I know it sounds a bit weird, but I do really feel that there's 'me' and there's another me. One who is processing and thinking, and another who is doing the day to day stuff and taking care of work, eating, sleeping, warmth etc.  I want to connect those people together. I guess that they are my parts, at least for today.

Take care, I don't know if you will want to read the above as it is quite a big paragraph of thoughts. It is fine to leave it 

Hi, a hug to you both, 

I am sorry I didn't respond earlier to you, dreamriver. I did read what you wrote and I planned to respond later. I am glad you enjoyed my Joni Mitchell reference  She is an amazing woman.

I am hearing you both about denial. It is definitely frightening to confront it. I like what dreamriver said - "slowly unwrapping it". I think that is a good way to approach  SaB

Thank you, Snowdrop, it is good to hear about the N. Here is to healing and being kind! 

I want to be kind to myself. I don't have to do this anymore. Cutting out anything good in my life because it threatens my sense of safety. I resist love where it threatens to overwhelm me. I look for meanings to a level that is not necessary. It doesn't mean I'm bad. I maybe am a bit broken. If I can allow all the horrible things to be, outside of me, I don't have to carry them inside. This is contrary to my conditioning. I'm healing and it is frightening.

Today I feel lost in time. I read some of my journal, and the me who wrote it seems far away. Some of the things I wrote in November, for example, feels a lifetime ago. I feel like it was a different person.

I know at heart that I don't give myself credit for things. when I feel this small and attacked then there is only one place the attacks come from and that's inside me. Feeling small and attacked can be a sign of an EF? I don't know, I just want to fight or flight, and not acknoweldge any of it.

One other thing that I am terrified of. I've been thinking a lot about NPD. I know that NPD can be caused by bad parenting. I am terrified that I am NPD, that all of this 'healing' is just another way of getting 'attention'. So, what's the answer? To abandon myself and abandon my feelings, because they don't exist or matter. Wanting to heal = being 'spoiled'. I really wish I could swear right now  My problems in relationships, do they mean that I am the problem? I am scared to death of this. I know there are places to discuss NPD, for example, OOTF, and while I know that my parents were disturbed and dysfunctional and imperfect, I worry that it is ME who is the N. I want to try to find a safe place to explore that topic, I don't think I have yet. It scares me and bothers me and again, it is the 'me' focus that turns my mind to NPD. However, I know that abandoning myself because I 'shouldn't spend so much time on me' is also dysfunctional behaviour and doesn't help me. I feel really stuck in a small place becasue of this right now.

... still finding it hard to say things were bad. I'm terrified that she's going to find out that I have written this, I'm just so scared.
How do I stop all of this? How do I just be okay? I'm so tired.

Hi Toya2007, this part of your post resonates with me because I recognise it so much.

From what you've said, your family dysfunction sounds like it has a lot of denial baked in. This can make it hard for us to believe ourselves.

I agree with what's said above, you deserve to be heard and you have done great to post despite your fear.

Thank you, Blueberry! I like this feeling of progress, that something has been achieved. Even if it doesn't last, I do mean to hold on to the memory of it working, as you suggest, and it should be easier to regain. That is the theory in any case