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Hi Artemis,

First, I want you to know that you're not alone. I've also - almost willingly - allowed myself to be re-victimized for many of the same reasons you mention. It sometimes feels like there's no comfortable middle ground between being needed and being rejected; no sense of movement if it isn't up or down; no sense of self without something to relate to. It's kind of like that saying "You can't know light without darkness." Well, these days I'm wishing more to know the twilight than anything else, just to get a breath of calm. But it doesn't seem like my choice. Just as you said, there's just this emptiness that others fill with whatever light or darkness they bring to the table, and something about being full feels just so much more....alive? Just writing it feels ridiculous because I know how unhealthy it sounds but it's true. You would know, right?

I've been on the tail end of this conversation enough to know that nothing I can say will make this feeling easier, but I at least want you to know that it's not crazy or abnormal. It's a natural result of what happened to you. There's only so much of yourself to give and when you've been trained from a young age and/or by powerful people to give it all for others, there's nothing left for you. It's a habit, maybe even an addiction. And I hope you feel proud for at least trying to leverage that habit for the good of others in helping them through their trauma.

One of my therapists recently turned me on to this books about codependency by Melanie Beattie. I haven't read them yet so I don't know if it would be of any help, but the premise sounds about right: not having a self without someone else, giving yourself only in the service of others, letting yourself be beat down because it's all you know. It might be worth looking into. Anyway, know that you are loved and supported here And thank you for your bravery in sharing.

I did this once when I really didn't have enough emotional energy to entertain my in-laws unannounced, plus I was really busy and time is valuable. Turns out they had some homegrown veg to drop round and when they didn't get an answer they unlocked the back door to the kitchen, put it on the table and then left again. Was fuming! It was only a 30 second dropoff and I was grateful for the gift but they let themselves in to my home. My safe space. I know many people would think I need to lighten up but I'm such a private person and I need my space.

That sounds absolutely infuriating, Blues! I know that they're technically "family" and maybe they have different ideas about what that means, but there's no excuse for letting yourself into another person's home. Like you said, it's supposed to be a safe space. I can definitely see how that's related to CPTSD because safety and control is something many of us lacked as children, so it makes sense that we would be protective about our security as adults. I know I am. And it's not even just about security; it's about respect. I'm so sorry that happened to you.

I hope your husband is eventually able to accept and support where your boundaries lie. You deserve that.

Hi Silentrhino,

I just want to echo Blues in saying that you deserved so much better from your childhood. Nine is far too young for adult responsibilities, let alone taking on the role of caregiver for anyone. You can barely take care of yourself at that age. I am so, so sorry that such pressure was put on you. And I don't think it's surprising that you would react to physical mementos of that time in your life - and even before - so powerfully. Something in you knows how wrong it was and rejects that; it sounds to me like a gut reaction to protect yourself, maybe? From having to relive that pain.

I also want you to know that you're not alone. I have also never felt that sort of pride in myself for any special skills or talent. Everything I do is either normal or subnormal and when others point out my skills, I assume they're just being flattering. I don't even think I've ever even tried to build talents, probably because I'm so "sure" I wouldn't be successful. I think it's hard to invest that much in yourself when you have to invest so much in everyone else. That love and careful attention and support that it takes to foster and celebrate growth.

I remember watching a Ted Talk with Dr David Burns once that dealt with this. He's the guy who popularized CBT as a method for coping with depression and PTSD. It's not much but maybe his example will help a bit. I hope so.

@Blueberry: Did you get a promotion recently, or did I fail to notice that fancy "Global Moderator" tag before? Either way, you deserve it - I've already gotten a lot of good thoughts out of your comments on Hope's and DR's posts.

@Boats: Thank you kindly. I look forward to seeing you around.

@DecimalRocket: It's good to be back We didn't get much time together before but I remember enjoying your contributions. Can't wait to get to know you better.

Hey Hope.

The description of your childhood home and relationships in your second post really resonated with me. We didn't have a physical 10-ft wall but there was certainly a psychic one, and the pressure to keep up the pretense of a "happy family" - as you so aptly phrased it - was strong. Talking to neighbors, attending family parties, even socializing after musical performances in middle school; my NM was always there pushing the loving nuclear family agenda, often on those adult figures who I might otherwise turn to for help. I think it's a coping mechanism that we inherit, that "mask."

I wonder if some of the social anxiety that comes along with CPTSD stems from knowing that social interactions tend to bring out the mask even when we know it's ineffectual and that we don't like it. As you stated, it can take time to relax into an interaction even for you, who is aware of the nasty effects of CPTSD and genuinely wants to enjoy your friendships. It's like when you know you're about to walk out into the freezing cold and you walk just a little slower as you approach the door; tense up as you open it; pause and brace yourself; all before the cold even hits. We know the mask is coming; that it's almost impossible to comfortably avoid; and so we react in advance.

All that said, I have to believe that just knowing the mechanics of how the anxiety arises means we can do something about it. Can't say I know for sure what that something is, but...hey, we're all trying to figure it out, right?

I hope that the rest of your day is bright and stress-free. And I look forward to discussing this more with you and others when you're ready. :heart:

Thank you all

Dark humor is one of my primary coping mechanisms! Thanks for the suggestion, woodsgnome. I'm looking forward to this one.

I haven't read it either but it sounds interesting. It could be helpful to read about others who have suffering childhood adversity but learned how to thrive not just because it show that we're "in good company" as the description suggests but also as a means a mining for ideas or wisdom for our own journeys.

The only caveat is that I think people suffering from cPTSD might need to be mindful of their frame of mind going into a more biographical book like this. Coming solely from personal experience, I still struggle with minimizing my childhood abuse because it was strictly emotional/psychological; coupled with the normal self-worth issues that come with cPTSD, this makes it hard for me to hear about the success of people who suffered physical, sexual, or so-called "more serious" forms of adversity without feeling like I'm blowing my own suffering out of proportion. Wallowing or exaggerating or begging for attention.  That said, it sounds like this book could have something inspirational to offer those who either don't suffer these same symptoms or are feeling strong enough to take in the wisdom.

Have you decided to read it, Recovery?

Hi Hope!

I just wanted to thank you, not only for sharing this book but for including your interpretations as it relates to re-parenting yourself. My approach to recovery has been deeply literal these days because I was in such a bad place; I need to be told exactly what to do to reorganize my thoughts and find a sort of "new normal." Your explanations have shown me exactly how those of us with cPTSD can use this book as a tool for recovery, and I so appreciate that. I'm sure others do, as well.

I look forward to reading more from you!

Hello (again). I was new to the forum at the end of last year and just starting to learn about CPTSD; unfortunately, I hit a rough patch, ended up in a hospitalization program for a few months, and took my time getting back you. But I'm feeling ready to embrace this journey and rejoin the community, hopefully a little stronger than before.

To my fellow "newbies": This place can give you profound comfort and strength if you let it. Welcome. We're happy to have you.

To everyone else: I've missed you and I'm happy to be back.

IME it's important to go slowly with the guilty feelings and self-blame. Figure out where you really maybe did make a mistake (which we all do) and where that was possibly the only way you could react due to CPTSD.

I wholeheartedly agree. I also want to remind you that those feelings of guilt and even shame, painful as they are - those feelings are what make you different from a true narcissist. The people who hurt us don't understand that what they've done is wrong. They block that knowing on purpose because they aren't strong enough or willing enough to deal with it. The fact that you are taking on the burden of that recognition is so strong and so important. As you've said, it's only the first step on the path to healing, but I would argue that it's the biggest one.

We're all here to support you Stay strong.

...but an intake worker interviewing you over the phone about your traumas like you're booking a vacation getaway for next year is absurd.

I'm so sorry to hear that you had to go through this addition trauma - which is exactly what it was - especially when your only goal was to get help. It's amazing how many people work in the mental health field as ancillary employees but don't have the basic empathetic skill set required to work with people who are suffering. You deserve better care. I hope that you're able to find a practice that will serve you in all way, not just in the therapist's office.

Good luck

Thank you so, so much CepheidVox. This is an amazing resource.

Thank you so much Resca.  I for one needed to hear that today xx

My pleasure. Let me know if you need another boost. You too, Blue <3

Thank you all very much for the support and validation. It's strange and impossible to know that you need help but be unable to feel that you're really worthy or "in need" enough - it's good to know that others understand that paradox. And thank you, Blue, for sharing your experience. That ability to "concentrate more on healing" is exactly what I'm looking for, because knowing the wounds are there but being unable to work on them is almost more unbearable then when I didn't understand what was wrong. It sounds like you went through a lot to find that space for healing, so I appreciate that you helped me with the same legwork.

I started the process of admission to that local IOP; got my doctor, the hospital, and my HR department on board. Now it's just a short wait for everyone to get in touch with each other and process the paperwork. Couldn't have gone through with it without all of your support. Oddly enough, something about giving into that feeling of being extra broken right now and seeking the help has taken part of the weight off

Hugs to you all, Blue, sanmagic, and Blanca. Thank you so much.