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I got a special notebook to work on and document my healing.  I have been watching youtube videos and reading a lot.......taking notes on everything. It might sound silly but I am treating it like going to school for self-esteem--and inner peace. I have really committed to LOVING myself. That seems to be my biggest hurdle. I never realized just how much I really did not love me, until recently. Like last night I did something unbelieveable. I was so angry with myself after. I found some pictures of myself from when I was pregnant with our youngest daughter. I was wearing a sports bra and bottoms.......I was nine months and ready to deliver.. so BIG  I didn't gain much weight while I was pregnant--only 25 pounds. So I was not overweight....but THIS is what I felt looking at the picture.......you look stupid, you have a dumb look on your face, your hair looks bad that length.....all of this superficial stuff and NOTHING about the fact that my body looked truly beautiful carrying our child. I cut it up and threw it away...............I cut several of them up and threw them away, thinking I looked like white trash and all of this horrible bad stuff. I caught myself........and then realized that was when my husband was addicted to porn......I had forgotten that that was when it was the worst. It was so weird how all of that came back and how bad it made me feel all over again about how I looked when there was NOTHING wrong with me. I realize I do this a lot. Maybe this is a flash back?  Thankfully I caught myself before I cut all of them up. I made myself look at my own face....my 30 year old body and really try to feel love for what I saw...........and it was HARD! My mom was always criticizing my body etc.....I remember she told me that I had a big butt when I was pregnant that time and how funny it was to see me with a big butt?? Looking at that pic I certainly did not. It was amazing all that it stirred up and the feelings were because of what others said......I took them in all of them and let them define me. I have done this all of my life. So I feel for me LOVING MYSELF is the best thing I can work on. I am really cruel to me. I have tried the inner child stuff and it just leaves me kind of "hollow"? Maybe I am not ready for it. I don't remember blocks of time when I was young. How did you all do it? Where did you start? And where has self love come into it for you? Thanks.

I can relate to what you are saying and am just beginning to catch myself when I start to feel this way......I can only speak for myself but for me it goes back to a family that never let me feel any real pride at what I was truly good at. Nothing was ever good enough and a lot of times was just not noticed. An example would be, I was really good in track. I would win and place most races. There was no doubt that it was real. But at home, it didn't exist, wasn't worthy of conversation. My dad did start coming to meets. My mom never did. It even extended to relatives not valuing things I did and letting their feelings be known. I am not sure if this is your situation, where it is a conditioned response to almost feel ashamed of being good at something..... because of how you were treated in the past when you excelled or completed some pretty amazing things and had every right to be proud of yourself. When people around us never make a big deal out of any of our successes or downplay them or give them 3 seconds of their attention......we learn in a weird way that there is something wrong with us sharing these experiences and to avoid that negative responses we get, we default.

When I catch myself doing that now tho, I stop. It is totally new to me, but I have realized it doesn't matter if nobody else is interested. I just did _______, and I have every reason to be proud of it. I have very recently started keeping a small journal with me where I have written prompts about these sorts of things to help me learn to have normal responses instead of the old ones that were put there.

By doing something self sabotaging, the focus immediately is taken off the success we just experienced but redirects us to fall right back into feeling bad about ourselves which sadly is a more comfortable state.

Coda, that was really good and very hopeful. Thank you for sharing.

I decided to try kindle unlimited for a month free on amazon. Well you get access to some really good books and one of them I read and am re-reading now is called Love Yourself Like Your Life Depended on it. It is such a simple idea but the way it is presented hit me so differently and I have been putting it into practice for close to a week now and just beginning to see a slight shift and it is amazing. For once I am just getting a taste of what it really feels like to love ME. It is all so new. And I never realized how much I hadn't been loving myself. I just wanted to share because it has helped so much already and I am seeing a beginning to an end of all the damage that has been done over the years. 

Welcome Batsville. I am still very new here and just beginning to find my way. This community is a great and very safe place. 

Cat, Rain, Trees and Kizzie....Thank you so much for your kind words  In the beginning I did go through an angry phase, but it did pass, and I was just so grateful..... I looked at life after, as a whole new life in a sense. There were things I wondered if I would get to see, like my daughters getting married. They both got married this past year.....and it was beyond wonderful being there. There were and still are many gifts.

I can honestly say, and this just shows how toxic they are, that dealing with my npd/bpd mom, endad and npd brother were honestly WORSE than having cancer! Seriously.

I read your responses over and over, and am just so grateful for all of them. Yay to you too Trees and Kizzie. Very happy we are all still here and that we have met. Thank you all for the wishes for my anniversary date. It is a really special day for me  Just posting here and having you say the things you did really helped me more than you know. It helped me realize that normal people are capable of responding and empathizing as much as possible. I think the times I have shared my cancer experience and that has happened it has been more about me sharing with the wrong people. Thank you for saying it wasn't me and that I shouldn't feel shame about this. I also agree very much with the bad guy analogy and nobody knowing what to say at times.

Cat I am so sorry you experienced similar things when trying to share about your dad.    Sometimes just the smallest acknowledgement is all we need. Just to feel heard and understood. 

I have noticed something that happens in my life over and over again and am not sure what to do about it. I was diagnosed with breast cancer almost 9 years ago now. 4-11 is my anniversary date ( I always do something fun to celebrate  ) It is a big deal to me still because a few months after I was dx'd my mom was. And then my first anniversary they thought it came back. Anyone who has been through this knows how crazy and surreal of an experience a cancer dx is. And it is a pretty life defining moment. I have taken the positive road in coping and used it as a kick in the pants to make a lot of very good life changes. The one thing that continues to haunt me and this is my question to others is.......how to handle people that when you mention it ( I have a lot of shame around this, like I should never tell anyone) to them, because somehow the subject has come up in conversation usually on their end.....and you open up about it a tiny and I do mean a tiny bit..........crickets, or a complete conversation change.........no acknowledging whatsoever of what you have just said. It just reinforces for me that I need to be quiet, I make people uncomfortable etc. I feel really good about living this long after a diagnosis. Very proud of the life changes I have made and everything. What kind of bugs me is in October these same people are all about the pink and the cure and blah blah, but in everyday life, they sure don't want to hear about it. It sometimes makes me feel bad that I still think about it. But it is a part of me, just like getting married and having kids, a very BIG deal. This time of year with the change of seasons, smells in the air, brings it all back. Not in a scary way anymore but in a grateful, I am still here way. How do you deal with people that make you feel uncomfortable for even bringing it up? I am not looking for sympathy or pity. It is usually in response to something they have said, so is relevant to the conversation. I find myself getting angry afterward, and then feeling stupid for once again opening up about something I shouldn't have. Do you think after so much time, I shouldn't be thinking of it? I don't know.....like I said I feel very grateful to be here and enjoy things that when it happened I wasn't sure I would. I hope this makes some sense. Thanks 

I have always been drawn to trees. Even when I was a kid........I couldn't get my play clothes on quick enough after school lol to just go out in the woods and hike and enjoy the presence. They all have a story. So many different kinds, and different survival stories. I have seen trees that the wind blew over, that regrouped and started growing parallel to the ground. We have a pine in our yard that is growing out of rock. They are so amazing. Very inspiring creations I think. I love the lone trees too. There are enormous evergreens here that survive months with about 3 feet of their trunks frozen in the creeks during the winter........so amazing and majestic! Just beautiful!!!

I have been talking to my husband about how I must have some weird vibe or something I give off, that the predatory types detect and move in on. I was having a hard time explaining it tho in a way  he would understand. Several days after our last conversation about that, I was outside playing with our puppy and noticing how there is a patch of aspens growing a little distance away from us. I have noticed them before, but this time I realized THEY are a perfect example of what I was trying to explain. They are all growing there and all very healthy looking, large trees. BUT there are some that are in the more shady, valley areas and they have a distinct bend to them, from years of trying to reach toward the sun. Something that comes so effortlessly to the others. So you have this huge grove of aspens, with most of them standing tall and straight but about a quarter of them are very obviously slanted to anyone that is looking on. I am thinking that is how people like me and others that are people pleasers and suffering from cptsd might look to somebody looking on. Yes we are all growing toward the sun, but some of us are bent over, from having to work a little harder to get there..........and to the wrong person, that "handicap" is what they notice and move in on. Like the trees, we can't see it in ourselves, but to someone else it is plain as day how different they are. I don't know if this makes any sense lol.......but it was a pretty powerful visual for me. 

A guy in a different group really helped me with doing that. He told me to write on my hand do not defend or even dnd when I went over any of my foo's so I could look at it for a reminder if I needed to. Well I started to do that...........realized even if I had the best source in the world......it was coming out of my mouth and therefore faulty    ...........It was interesting while doing that just how OFTEN I felt the need to defend or back up my comments.........it really helped me. The way they treat you makes you feel so invisible. And once you get rid of them, you start working through your list of other contacts.......it is kind of sad how often you can see that being played out in other arenas.

As time went on they made an acronym JADE------- Do not: Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain. That helps me to this day 

Good for you!!!!!!!!!!!  I have to have it somewhat for my business, but plan to keep it as minimal as possible now and not so much "false socialization" I love that term by the way! I go through my friend list and could count on one hand the number of people I would not put in the narcissistic category....not necessarily pd level, but definitely on the high end. I am finding so much more time for studying, painting, creating, exercising etc. Facebook is bad news for me  It is an interesting bit of proof to myself how I have attracted the wrong kind of people. I am sorry you experienced that, but so admire you for unplugging!

That is pretty eye opening in itself I think, that nobody contacted you.  Kind of proves exactly what we are talking about it. The first day was the hardest, but every day after just gets easier and I find myself feeling happier too. I have one exercise group and one local group I will stay in contact with, but the rest nah......it just isn't worth it. I get so tired of being there for everyone for their ups and downs and not getting the same back. Even tho there have been some bad things in my life recently, there have also been some really great ones, and nothing......I have put too much energy into them and I need to stop......for my own well-being  I was afraid of that too, but what we are getting here feels so much more genuine and definitely more positive!! 

First let me say........I can completely understand what you are saying. I am wired that way also and at times it can be MORE than frustrating. I am really surprised to hear what you have discovered. I would have thought just the opposite of men. I find that really interesting. However, I do understand your need for having that in your life and how that situation would just complicate matters.

I am in a 31 year marriage and most of it was absolutely crazy fun amazing in that department    .........then my husband got diagnosed with low testosterone....REALLY low and that part of our relationship completely stopped...pretty abruptly.....nothing except for a couple awkward tries in THREE years. To say going without has been tough HA HA HA would be a joke. I absolutely lost it on him one day.......I was so frustrated. Things were rough for quite a while as I tried along with him to accept our new reality. Finally, and this is only very recent........I have come to a place of acceptance. We hug and cuddle and kiss but that is it. I love him too much to leave him and we did enjoy a fantastic run.........what has helped me and might help you......YES, YES with the exercising. Weight lifting, running, and now I have discovered yoga. I cannot explain it, but keep in mind I can totally relate to that comment about being a teenage guy lol...........yoga has helped mellow me I guess you could say, in that area. If you do it consistently it can help you manage the most unbearable situations, and this would definitely qualify. I have just returned to it religiously for all the help it has given me. A decent practice for at least 40 mins 6 times a week.

I wish I had more to offer, because really loving that aspect of life and not being able to have it in a way that feels right for you is one of the MOST frustrating things to ever have to endure.

One last thing. You mentioned your age, and that it is getting worse.....some women, us lucky ones lol, seem to get a stronger drive as we age, because of all the hormone shifting going on. At your age, I felt exactly like you are describing. I am ten years older and even tho yeah, I would be ready at the drop of a hat    ........the craziness of it has died off some......... 

Thank you for bringing up this subject. If nothing else it is nice to hear that there are other women out there that are wired more like men. Society can make you feel so strange for being this way.

Cat, I could so relate to your post. And yes, definitely the scapegoat. It was so bad in our house...just my brother and me, no other siblings... that I could say something and literally be laughed out of the room, and then he could say the same thing and they would be all ears. Even if I did try to back things up with some real proof, a book or something......that wouldn't be taken seriously. Of course they had never heard of that author or book or whatever.  For me it was such a lack of confidence in me that I absorbed and that unfortunately I am still fighting to this day. Little by little I am getting rid of the friends in my life that fuel that. And I have started a business that I am getting lots of positive feedback on. It is my own thing and this feels so nice and SO different for me, in  a GOOD way 

Ha ha, thank you C. I think I am a real contradiction......I LOVE art, and medicine :-) They have both fascinated me forever. I really hated how she would always put my stuff/ideas/feelings down and usually with an audience around. I just wanted to hide when she did that.

I have made a decision to spend WAY less time of facebook, because the types of people I meet on there are very triggering to me lately and to let go of any and all friendships that are not equal. I am done!! If I have to be alone for a period, so be it. I will survive. When you are surrounded by people that make you feel and think less of yourself.......that is worse than alone.  So bubye!  I am going to do things for me that reinforce living authentically. Even if it feels scary and awkward for a while. 

C. It sounds like you have a great plan in place for your friendship. A lot of what you are saying is very similar to my situation. I like that you have taken the time and laid out a plan that works for you.....you still talk, when it is right, and you are still taking care of you which is the most important. We too have encouraged each other through our growth and support each other that way. To be honest it can be a little one sided, but when she does support me, I believe it is sincere as I don't think that sort of thing comes easily or naturally to her at all.  That is smart to start by text, because yes, they definitely can suck you in. I have found myself taking less and less calls from people in general, because that seems to be a pattern in my life. I need to work on myself more before that changes....I need to feel comfortable telling people I can't talk or need to go and if they get mad they get mad. You often end up feeling like a free therapist and I am beginning to resent that dynamic....A LOT. I loved what you said about validating her empathy! That is excellent. Definitely going to put that into my bag of new communication tools. Thank you. Your post brought up great points and really helps! 

marycontrary......so with you on that.  I am very comfortable with alone time and as I have gotten older realize I crave it even more. I need that calming time for my brain, to just chill, breathe and even enjoy the absolute quiet sometimes. I am really happy for you that you have replaced the dysfunctional relationships with great ones. That gives me so much hope. Truth be told I can isolate now.....there is a certain kind of exhaustion I feel and I am honoring it rather than feeling bad about it. It keeps my energy at a better level by recognizing it and going with it. At the same time I need to work to not isolate too much which I think unfortunately would be too easy for me.  Those relationships are incredibly stressful and just feed the cptsd. That is really interesting she was a nurse and did those things.......she, if anyone should have understood what she was doing to herself and you, knowing that you had cptsd. Good for you for getting away as quick as you could! And for having enough strength to confront your boyfriend also.   I agree with you. I think you nailed it, we spoil them and they become entitled. I end up feeling extremely taken for granted in those situations.

I was wondering if this rang true with you also. Do you find yourself when with others, especially pd'd family members, downplaying your gifts....dumbing down your conversations......acting like you don't know things, when you really do for fear of being seen as full of yourself or bragging......meanwhile they drone on and on about all of their superficial accomplishments  For some reason, lately I have really been noticing how much I do this. Like I want to hide or protect certain aspects of myself. I know it was a conditioned response. My dad made it clear I was not college material.........when I would say things about wanting to be a doctor...pediatrician at the time my mom would chime in with how depressing that would be for a job day in and day out.....my art work was always criticized by my mom and so many other things......so there was this battle going on inside.........when people would accidentally find out I did certain things and compliment me, immediately I would hear her or their snide comments........it was like there was the out of the house truth and the family truth. I don't know if this is making any sense........but it was so crazy making. So this year, I want to really work on being me whatever that means........really work on unearthing the real person inside. WHY should I hide things I am good at? That serves nobody. Just curious how many of you could sort of relate to this. Thanks!