Out of the Storm

I guess it's depression, which is part of the CPTSD.  When I came OOTF, I realized that for the last 2+ years, I have ignored everything in my life that wasn't screaming for attention.  I don't work, so you'd think my life would be in order.  But it's a mess.  I make the basic effort to keep the house clean enough that I'm not living in squalor, and I usually manage to keep the bills paid before they are late.  Other than that, I just can't get myself motivated enough to care about anything. 

It's particularly bad now, when I am not even interested in doing anything enjoyable.  Usually I at least like to read or watch tv, but there are plenty of days that I spend in bed, or just sort of staring off into space.  I have therapy tomorrow, and I don't want to go.  I don't want to talk, analyze, or work on anything. 

I do have good days, where I work frantically to try to catch up on the things I neglect.  But they aren't often or consistent enough for me to gain any traction.  I'm constantly in catch up mode. 

I think this is also the freeze part of CPTSD. 

Does anyone relate?  Have any advice about getting thru this?  I try to just force myself, but that doesn't work much. 

(((hugs)))

I am so sorry you're feeling so low right now.  :'(

I have had a severe depression last year - pretty much the way you describe it. I felt crippled and went back to bed most days as soon as my kids had left the house. I am an absolute foodie under normal circumstances, but I hardly ate anything and didn't even fancy a Belgium chocolate any more (...that's when even my DD got really worried...).

Like you, I was in therapy at the time. I told my t about my depression and how severe it had become. She put the CPTSD treatment on hold and just helped me through my depression first. Which turned out to be a good call.

I had to be really really nice to myself - like I was the most important and most precious person in the world. I had to get out of the house every day and force myself to do/buy something which I would normally enjoy and feel it/them. Next session, I had to report back to her.

On my way home, I made myself stop at a place where they sell the best handmade Belgium chocolates in town. I bought a box of them and forced myself to eat one chocolate that night. Next day, I bought myself a cussion for my couch - fluffy and nice and totally my own. The next day, I bought a psychology magazine that was full of positive thoughts. Then, I went to a musical event with my family in the next village.... but each night, one chocolate until I started enjoying them again (took weeks, literally). They were a kind of lifeline for me (along with the other things and activities of course).

Then, when I started feeling a bit better, I didn't need my one chocolate a day any more (...which is a good thing because those little buggers are quite costly  ;) ). But I still have a box in the house with a few left for 'emergencies' - to remind myself that even in black days there is something nice and that I can find it if I keep hanging in there.

eo - hang in there! Be nice really to yourself and ask your t for help!

Sending good thoughts and hugs your way. kf

KF thanks for these suggestions. Dark chocolate is my favorite and I have one square a day of fine dark chocolate and glad it's a suggested therapeutic indulgence ! :)  seriously though, a daily indulgence of some sort as a treat is a most helpful idea.

@Emotionaloverload... So sorry You described everything I have been trying to get out of the depression hole for the last several months. {{{HUGS}}} It is not easy getting out.. I feel better for a few days and then splat I am back on the bed again..

Reading on here and OOTF helps me. I think It helps by giving me permission to do something for myself and reminds me I am not a lone!

@keepfinghting.
I had to be really really nice to myself - like I was the most important and most precious person in the world. I had to get out of the house every day and force myself to do/buy something which I would normally enjoy and feel it/them. Next session, I had to report back to her.

On my way home, I made myself stop at a place where they sell the best handmade Belgium chocolates in town. I bought a box of them and forced myself to eat one chocolate that night. Next day, I bought myself a cussion for my couch - fluffy and nice and totally my own. The next day, I bought a psychology magazine that was full of positive thoughts. Then, I went to a musical event with my family in the next village.... but each night, one chocolate until I started enjoying them again (took weeks, literally). They were a kind of lifeline for me (along with the other things and activities of course).


I don't think I treat myself very nice. I procrastinate so much. Even doing things I need to do for MYSELF. I am trying to work from lists now..At least I feel a sense of accomplishment when I work on the lists.

Quote from: keepfighting on September 01, 2014, 06:56:57 PM

I had to be really really nice to myself - like I was the most important and most precious person in the world. I had to get out of the house every day and force myself to do/buy something which I would normally enjoy and feel it/them.

KF, tks so much for posting this - it speaks so clearly to our need to be kind, patient, and loving with our selves. 

Oh my goodness, Emotion Overload, I am in exactly the same place you are.  I am so sorry for you, but I hope therapy went well and helped you.  When I am in this mode, it only makes me feel worse about myself.  The one thing I do is write down on my calendar every little thing I accomplish for that day.  Then when I look back over the week before I can see that I was not completely "lazy" as some would say.  Some days I can do more than others.  Do you ever think back to the times when you were so busy and you wonder how you accomplished everything?  I do that when remembering taking care of my children when they were home, or when I remember taking care of my parents.  It exhausts me to even think about doing that much again.   :)

So yes, I am not much interested at this point in trying to analyze or work on my problems.  Maybe it is because the trauma is still so fresh for me. 

Badmemories, I see that you make lists also.  It does help.  And chocolate for sure!!

Hi NotMotivated

I can relate.  I have a hard time with what I refer to as lazy behaviour, but it more likely depression and/or procrastinating because of fear of trauma or failure. 

I forced myself to go to my therapist today.  She said, I want to give you some perspective into your life.  You are beating yourself up for being stuck here, but looking at your story, it is amazing that you have held it together as well as you have.  You haven't done it perfectly.  But the fact that you come here every week, with more research than I have EVER seen any other client bring, means that there is something in you that is driving you to get well. 

I almost cried.  I do have a rough story, which I'm not sure I've shared here.  But she equated it to a whirlwind of managing a PD marriage, and then my uBPDh died.  Things didn't calm down from there, I then suffered a whirlwind of crazy in the 6 years since his death.  She said it was normal that I was where I was, and implied that it was actually a very strong person who would even try to come back from that.

I asked about the prognosis.  She said recovery is possible.  Sometimes it is longer than others.  We talked in terms of the layers of the onion.  If we can find the core, it can go faster.  But she will only ever go at my pace.

I love my T. 

Can you clone your therapist? She sounds really nice.

What you wrote has been the story of my life for the past dozen years or more. I'm jobless, too, and there's this part of me that thinks this means my place should be extra clean and super tidy. That thought triggers emotional flashbacks. I only realized this just now. I was depressed as a child (undiagnosed, of course), and I got a lot of emotional abuse for the symptoms. So nowadays when I get sleepy or sad, a part of me panics and wants to go into overdrive to prove my worth. Only, that never works, because emotional flashbacks puts on the handbrake on everything. No wonder I don't get anything done.

Maybe we shouldn't compare ourselves to people without CPTSD when it comes to how much we get done. If you've lost a leg, you'd expect things to be slower, messier, and less efficient than before. Isn't CPTSD like that? The nicest thing I ever read on the topic of "mothers and housework" is: "nobody ever had to go into therapy because their mother didn't hoover enough."

It's good you went for therapy and she sounds wonderful! Prognosis positive. Motivation vs enthusiasm. Once looked up the definitions. Motivation is a thing of the mind and I often confuse this with enthusiasm which is an emotion. Don't need to be enthused to be motivated, need to decide to do something and do it, that's motivation.

Quote from: schroedingerskatze on September 09, 2014, 07:09:57 PM
Can you clone your therapist? She sounds really nice.

What you wrote has been the story of my life for the past dozen years or more. I'm jobless, too, and there's this part of me that thinks this means my place should be extra clean and super tidy. That thought triggers emotional flashbacks. I only realized this just now. I was depressed as a child (undiagnosed, of course), and I got a lot of emotional abuse for the symptoms. So nowadays when I get sleepy or sad, a part of me panics and wants to go into overdrive to prove my worth. Only, that never works, because emotional flashbacks puts on the handbrake on everything. No wonder I don't get anything done.

Maybe we shouldn't compare ourselves to people without CPTSD when it comes to how much we get done. If you've lost a leg, you'd expect things to be slower, messier, and less efficient than before. Isn't CPTSD like that? The nicest thing I ever read on the topic of "mothers and housework" is: "nobody ever had to go into therapy because their mother didn't hoover enough."

I really relate to this.  I kept my house clean as a child.  I don't recall my mother ever cleaning.  It's just hard, becaucse I want to feel productive about something.  But as it turns out, cleaning gives me no satisfaction.  I don't care.  I need to find something to makes me feel productive, satisfied, and whorth something.

Quote from: emotion overload on September 10, 2014, 06:36:24 PM
...I want to feel productive about something.  But as it turns out, cleaning gives me no satisfaction. 

Exactly! It's like blowing one's nose: it's necessary and you do it, but nobody in their right mind would ever make it the be-all and end-all of their existence. You'd never get any TV ad showing a blissful woman says: "I tested this new hanky and now I have the most amazingly shiny nose!" And nobody would expect blowing my nose to fulfill me as a woman.

I tried to be a good housewife, but then my CPTSD got worse and I capitulated. I'm now trying to organize my lethargy. I've made a three-level plan.

Level 0: have unrelenting standards, be triggered, battle CPTSD.
Level 1: I do the tasks that, if I don't do them, get me or my kid in trouble. (Fix meals, buy toilet paper, buy birthday presents, do my techniques that help me keep my CPTSD bearable,...).
Level 2: I fix/organize/clean everything that really annoys me until it doesn't annoy me anymore.
Level 3: I take my kitchen timer with me and spend five minutes on each room. (Intervals up to 20 minutes work. Everything else feels too long.) And every day, I'm cleaning one room. Monday is kitchen day. The task gets divided into a basic program plus one extra task. Basic kitchen program: tidy, do dishes, wipe down surfaces, clean draining board and sink. Weekly extra: either clean windows OR wipe cabinet fronts OR declutter a shelf (etc etc). Pick just one, no more.

This plan isn't fully foolproof. But it has the advantage of keeping the unrelenting standards at bay that my mother had when I was a child. It gives me a feeling of being in control. And it helps with the lack of motivation. I can't "tidy the living room", but I can spot the most annoying bit of clutter and then tidy that up. I can't "clean all the things", but I can clean my sink and draining board. There's also this in-built level at which I get to feel accomplished. On Mondays, once I've tidied things up a bit and done the kitchen, then that's it, I achieved my goal, everything else I do is a bonus. It's calming, that thought.

(Sorry this is so long. Most probably this won't be helpful for anyone but myself. I just thought I'd risk posting it anyway.)

You sound like a Fly Lady graduate! ;)

That's this program on how to do chores, yes? I heard of it, but I never did it. I read as far as her advice on how to clean draining boards. She realy, really hates dirty draining boards. From what I remember, she only jiiust goes short of throwing molotov cocktails on them to try and explode the dust particles. Since part of my problem are my mother's really high standards plus her insistence that there's a "right way" to doing chores, I didn't read further.

The "room of the day" thing and the "basic program plus one extra task" are from a Swiss book. A friend of mine enthused at me about it until I gave it a try. The "so-and-so many minutes" approach is the pomodoro technique, but I heard from it first in an article about how to overcome writer's block.

Now there's a thought! I have Cleaner's Block!

Quote from: schroedingerskatze on September 11, 2014, 05:04:24 AM
Now there's a thought! I have Cleaner's Block!

:D :D :D

Finally! A name for it!  ;)

I studied translation at university. Translators know that finding the right term fixes everything.

That isn't even a joke. Okay, it is, but it's got a kernel of truth to it. The Sapir-Whorf-Hypothesis says that how we conceptualize and use language has some effect on how we conceptualize the world, maybe even on how we feel about things and on what we end up doing. (If this weren't so, prunes would never have been rebranded as "dried plums", and marketing departments wouldn't exist.)

More specifically, there's the relationship between a word and its meaning. In translation theory, some call it the scene and the frame. (Or signifiant and signifié, but I find that sounds less snazzy.) The "scene" is what you picture in your head, the "frame" is how you express it. You hear "mousse au chocolat" (frame) and it instantly evokes tastes, smells, specific memories, maybe a certain kind of chocolate, maybe the social setting you expect to find it in, maybe the colour of your favourite bowl. All of that taken together is the scene.

So my theory is: In CPTSD, some real and actual events are framed in inaccurate, spin-doctoring terms. Those terms then evoke toxic, unhelpful scenes.
Actual fact: lethargy, freeze response, depression. Frame: "lazy", "inept", "selfish", "worthless". Scene: every memory ever where I felt lazy and worthless. Effect: emotional flashback. Lesson learned: find an accurate way of talking about lethargy. Points in favour:

• Accurate terms always have priority. (Even my inner critic agrees, so probably he's a translator as well.
• Recovery entails learning that I have every right to let the truth be the truth, so this word thing is a part of healing. A tiny part maybe, but a part.
• Most of those toxic frames and scenes are taken from people who abused me. Those are their thoughts, not mine; not originally. I'm taking back my right to look at my own experiences and find proper words for it.

[li]Those toxic frames and scenes are process-oriented. They take housework and make it so it's all about character faults. This is not how a professional would think. A professional would first attentively observe the present situation; then work out a desirable and reachable goal; then work out strategies and ways of reaching it that are doable; then go on doing it. A professional would be goal-oriented and realistic, always checking the real world for facts and feedback. Therefore, if I refuse to feel "lazy" when I'm slowed down by an emotional flashback, I'm being professional. (Again: professionalism is always a good thing in my culture, and my inner critic agrees, so the mere use of the word "professional" calms him.)
[/li][/list]

In other words: hi, I'm schrödingerskatze, and I routinely overthink the fact that I hate hoovering.

I love the posts here.  Because yes, it does have to do with the CPTSD.  Somedays I am on the ball, the house is as tidy as it gets for me.  Somedays (and these days can turn into weeks), things fall apart. 

But yeah, I am going to remember the kleenex analogy.  No one wants to spend their time making the house perfect (and if they do, god bless them)

Very though provoking writing. Thank You for sharing it! :)

schrödingerskatze, interesting concept. Love it!

Thanks for your kind words. I was afraid I'd theorized too much. Phew.

:)

Ditto that  ;)   I like the way you lay things out and have a good look at them, gets the brain cells going!

I have read This quit a few times and I get more and more out of it. You wrote:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So my theory is: In CPTSD, some real and actual events are framed in inaccurate, spin-doctoring terms. Those terms then evoke toxic, unhelpful scenes.
Actual fact: lethargy, freeze response, depression. Frame: "lazy", "inept", "selfish", "worthless". Scene: every memory ever where I felt lazy and worthless. Effect: emotional flashback. Lesson learned: find an accurate way of talking about lethargy. Points in favour:
Accurate terms always have priority. (Even my inner critic agrees, so probably he's a translator as well.
Recovery entails learning that I have every right to let the truth be the truth, so this word thing is a part of healing. A tiny part maybe, but a part.
Most of those toxic frames and scenes are taken from people who abused me. Those are their thoughts, not mine; not originally. I'm taking back my right to look at my own experiences and find proper words for it.

• Those toxic frames and scenes are process-oriented. They take housework and make it so it's all about character faults. This is not how a professional would think. A professional would first attentively observe the present situation; then work out a desirable and reachable goal; then work out strategies and ways of reaching it that are doable; then go on doing it. A professional would be goal-oriented and realistic, always checking the real world for facts and feedback. Therefore, if I refuse to feel "lazy" when I'm slowed down by an emotional flashback, I'm being professional. (Again: professionalism is always a good thing in my culture, and my inner critic agrees, so the mere use of the word "professional" calms him.)
  -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  

In My FOO I was called Lazy.
Step1 actual fact. My UNPDM has Ocd tendencies. I could eat off of her floor anytime it was so clean. Her FOO was messy and cluttered, think Hoarding. I think she handles the Abuse from MyuNPD STD by the flight method. keeping busy to forget. He might have abused her IF things were not immaculate. FACTS about me: I am intelligent, I am a combo FAWN/freeze. I am sentimental, uNPDM likes everything new and shiny. FOO was poor, mostly because uNPD stD drank the money away...since I am sentimental then I like old stuff. uNPD calls it junk. A good way for me to freeze was to sit in MY bunk bed reading. I read everything that was in the house. (I even read a NAVY manual about swimming, saving lives from the Korean war) My Mother routinely threw away trinkets that I had collected in one sock drawer.
STEP 2: So the FOO words used to describe me are, lazy, messy, nervous, scatterbrained, professor, granny,

so to reframe MY list I do this:

• Lazy: I (must have earned from an early age to freeze by sitting quietly and reading. That kept me from My uNPDM's sight and out of trouble.) I escaped MY troubled childhood by persuing books to escape. None could take My knowledge away from me. Unlike MY uNPDM threw MY STUFF AWAY.   
• Messy: I don't remember being so messy really, but in the eyes of a OCD person, anything was messy. So, I frame the truth as NORMAL.
• Scatterbrained,Nervous: I also frame this as normal...I mean what child put through the crap I was wouldn't be forgetful? What Child would NOT BE nervous wondering when the next shoe would fall? Also on Scatterbrained...I lived in a pretend world to SURVIVE the Abuse.
• Professor, NOT really negative but to understand it...I read everything in sight. I read continuously to avoid the abuse (IF I was out of sight I was out of mind to uNPDM) So I taught Myself to read and I read what was in the house, so I was reading Old High school textbooks by 3RD grade. So I use the word intelligent, self taught.
• Granny, This was really a Name My siblings gave me. actually I am fond of the name and haven't heard it much since my brothers died.  :'( :'(  The Name is accurate though because i was the OLDEST child, I took over the role of Mother because MY Mother was NOT very emotional, so I was the one that soothed My siblings, I was the one that gave them advice, I was the MOTHER.

So the new LIST I have compiled is:

• Lazy=staying out of trouble by being quit and out of sight.
• messy= A normal child that made some messes, but it is normal. sentimental
• scatterbrained, nervous, =normal any child would react the same way with said abuse.
• Professor=intelligent, thoughtful, self educated.
• Granny=loving, caring, therapist, caretaker, responsible

Wow, thanks.  ;D   I love this forum. Glad to hear this was useful to you. Yay yay yay yay yay!

And I'm sorry to hear about your brothers. I'm guessing since you were parenting them, their deaths must have been especially hard to take.

1977 the worst year of My life.. I lost 2 brothers, My brother -in Law,and 2 of My brother's close friends, all to suicide. Someone ran over My cat that summer also. I think I just Froze. I think I was numb for at least 2 years.

Out of the 3 siblings left. My uNPDS talks about it all the time, but never resolves it. My Brother ( who lost his twin) NEVER talks about it. he swept it under the rug. I feel I have worked out the pain and guilt.

BadMemories - {{Hugs}}  that's a lot to deal with, but you are doing some great work to get through it rather than stuff it down.  Kudos.

(((BadMemories)))

What a horrible horrible loss to bear.

Shame that your bro and sis are in very different places than you are in dealing with it.

You haven't chosen the easiest way to deal with all the hurt, but probably the healthiest. Keep on going! Kudos!

Hey Katz - what do you think about an exercise worksheet based on your earlier post?  I think it would be a really useful for the the Toolbox. Sorry, no pressure (not much anyway), just a thought  ;D   

Gladly. How about I post it here so you all can give me feedback before we post it "officially"?

Here's what such a worksheet might look like. Please tell me if it's doable. I've only ever done this for myself, and have no idea whether it's at all useful. Also, half of it is taken from Badmemories' post, so it's not my worksheet, it's ours. I'm hoping it's okay that I took her post as inspiration? (Badmemories, tell me if it isn't and I'm going to change things.)

-----------------------------

PROBLEMATIC COGNITION. What's the toxic thought or concept that's in my head right now (or that was in my head during a specific EF)?

Example: "I'm lazy and inept"

HOW TO FIND OUT MORE ABOUT THIS: (if you already know clearly what the problematic thought is, skip straight to step one)

BEHAVIOUR. How am I acting? Take a step back and observe yourself like you're a sociologist. What are you doing now that you aren't doing when you're feeling well?

Example: physically exhausted, avoid leaving the house, avoid doing even small and mundane tasks, overeating, spending too much time playing computer games.

BONUS QUESTION: Does this happen to vaguely remind you of one of the four standard responses to overwhelming stress (Fight, Flight, Fawn, and Freeze)?

Freeze response

FEELINGS AND THOUGHTS. Sometimes it's triggering to delve too far into one's own feelings and thoughts, so be kind to yourself and let yourself be as detailed or vague as you know is good for you right now. Sometimes dipping our toe into the truth is enough, we don't have to dive into it off a cliff.

Having said that: while you're acting this way, how do you feel about yourself and/or about the world? What tags did your abusers pin to you?

(Lazy, selfish, inept, not doing enough of my duty, not being selfless enough because if I were I'd be able to willpower my way out of this, and this proves that I'm worthless. People will emotionally abuse me for this.)

(The following is taken from Badmemories' response.)

REFOCUSSING. Look at the situation again. (Or, look at it as closely as is good for you. You'll know best. Maybe you already have methods of ensuring you're safe while you do this. Mine is, if I find a situation or memory too stressful to contemplate, I mentally turn it into a tilt-shift photograph that I then make black-and-white.) What would be a realistic way of describing the situation? What's the truth?

I'm going into Freeze because something triggered an EF. Once the EF is over, I'll have more energy. Another thing is, my mother was classic Hero Child who responded to her traumas and problems with grimly determined actionism. At such times especially, her standards were exacting, and she'd try to exert control down into the tiniest detail. Since her temper was on a hair-trigger, it was best to stay out of her way - to just be small and insignificant, nothing that got in her way or attracted her attention.

STEP TWO: What's a realistic way of talking about this? What words would accurately describe this?

I'm not lazy, I just have a healthy self-preservation instinct that's unfortunately stuck in DUCK-FOR-COVER mode. I'll move out of this, but it will take time.

STEP THREE. What then is a realistic way of behaving in this situation? What would be the kind, realistic thing to do? Imagine someone you really like and respect, someone competent and strong and sane who always has good reasons for what she does, it doesn't even matter if they're real or if they're historical or fictional. Imagine this person is in precisely the same situation you just described realistically. How would you act towards her? What would you advise she do (can be something big like "cut off contact to that person for at least a year", or something subtle and tiny, or both - whatever's doable and realistically possible right now.)

EXAMPLE: (editing mode won't let me use italics) Educate myself about what normal standards and a normal amount of work look like. Set myself one or two goals that I know I can reach even on a * day like this one, and regard everything else as bonus tasks that I get to feel very smug and accomplished for doing. Write about this so I can vent and rage and emote a little about this. Make espresso. Switch on the radio.

-----------------------

What do you think? I'm especially wondering if I shouldn't simply scratch the first few questions and just start with the two steps Badmemories developped. Shorter worksheets are easier to use. Sometimes if I'm stressed out and I see a big-* CBT worksheet, a part of me goes "oh dear NO".

Or maybe those are two worksheets? A short one for when you already know about a specific word or toxic mental concept that got pinned on you. A longer one for dissecting EFs. If so, then I'm not sure at all that I haven't maybe left out a necessary step? I'll road-test this, but I'd also love to hear what you think.

And I'm not sure about step three. Is there a better way of saying this? Or is that step superfluous? What if someone just can't think of anything to do and then they'd feel  even worse?

Anything that anyone wants to use that I post is fine! Great Idea!

Thanks so much for this Katz and for allowing us to use your examples BadMemories!

One thing I was thinking is that perhaps if it were two pages, one with a description of the process, much like you did in your original post Katz and examples such as yours and BadMemories and then have a separate worksheet (that has less to read and is a  fairly simple, clean page with headings and perhaps a short directional sentence), that would be helpful for people - they wuld have an overview of what they're going to do before they do it.

It's your description of reframing and yours and BadMemories examples that set this apart from other CBT exercise sheets and the use of the language "frame" "reframe" is different from CBT and may help users to understand the process more easily, especially when the language of CPTSD (e.g., EFs, the four F's) is included.  I think too that even though most people doing the worksheet will know what these CPTSD related terms mean, it would be helpful to include a description of each on the worksheet (thus two pages would probably be best), so users are all on the same page and they don't have to go elsewhere to read up.

I think Step Three is crucial in all of this so I would definitely keep it.   

Excellent job Katz, thanks for your work on this  ;D   Anyone else have feedback for Katz? 

I like the Idea on keeping a worksheet simple. It makes it easier to work with! now but I will work on shortening the 4 F's part of it and post it here when I do it!

I have to do some cleaning My daughter is going to have a heart attack when she gets home. she is somewhat OCD... I raised her and My Son and let them discover their world! It is a messy way because they get out stuff and don't put it back. It does raise intelligent kids though. I am easy going and don't mind the mess to a point. Then it drives me crazy and then I have to get it all put away again! it is at that point RIGHT NOW! My Grandaughter will help me, but she is only 5 so she can't do a lot of it. Today she has been writing on the turtle tank with a grease pen, drawing, papers all over, playing with her dolls, playing with Lego's, eating soup, dishes still in LR, and reading books...so the carpet is covered with the stuff she has been doing!  ;) ;)

How does this look? 




A "scene" is what you picture in your mind, the "frame" is how you express it. For example, you hear "mousse au chocolat" (frame) and it instantly evokes tastes, smells, specific memories, maybe a certain kind of chocolate, maybe the social setting you expect to find it in, maybe the colour of your favourite bowl. With CPTSD scenes are often framed by our Inner Critic (Icr) in ways that trigger Emotional Flashbacks, a habit of thinking that we can learn to interrupt and/or counteract by changing the language we use to reframe the scene and defuel the ICr.

CPTSD Scene: Housework – you look around your house and it does not meet the (perfectionistic) standards you set for yourself which engages your Inner Critic.

CPTSD Frame: Your ICr kicks in and tells you that you are lazy, that nothing you do is ever good enough, that you are not good enough and never will be,  and triggers an Emotional Flashback (EF). You feel like a small child overwhelmed by feelings of worthlessness and of being defective., and perhaps freeze or feel anxious and depressed.

Reframe:  Your ICR's assessment of the scene is not accurate.  The toxic framing is taken from the past, from layers of pain and trauma that were inflicted by people who abused you. Those are their thoughts, not yours and you need to take back your right to look at your experiences and find realistic, rational and kinder words for reframing the event.

EXAMPLE EXERCISE

Step One:  Identify the Scene - Ask yourself "What is the problematic thought that triggered my EF?

Example: My house is a mess (Scene)

Step Two: How Did I Frame the Scene? - Ask yourself "What feelings did the scene evoke and where did that come from?"

Example: I am lazy (Frame) which then because of our CPTSD can devolve into feeling worthless, inept and other negatives as the Inner Critic gets rolling.  Where did that come from? My FOO repeatedly told me I am lazy, selfish, inept, not doing enough of my duty, not being selfless enough because if I were I'd be able to willpower my way out of this, and this proves that I'm worthless. I'm going into a "Freeze" response because my mother was responded to her traumas and problems with grimly determined actionism. At such times especially, her standards were exacting, and she'd try to exert control down into the tiniest detail. Since her temper was on a hair-trigger, it was best to stay out of her way - to just be small and insignificant, nothing that got in her way or attracted her attention.

Step Three:   How Can I Reframe the Scene? - Ask yourself, "What is a more accurate, realistic and kinder way of thinking about this?"

Example: I am not lazy and my house is just fine.  I only feel this way because I learned to be perfectionistic to protect myself in childhood from my FOO's criticism and rejection.  These are ghost voices from the past that interfere with my life and which I will banish.




Step One:  Identify the Scene - Ask yourself "What is the problematic thought that triggered my EF?







Step Two: How Did I Frame the Scene? - Ask yourself "What feelings did the scene evoke and where did that come from?"









Step Three:   How Can I Reframe the Scene? - Ask yourself, "What is a more accurate, realistic and kinder way of thinking about this?"

OK, the completed version of the Reframing exercise is attached and has also been uploaded to the "Recovery" forum under "Toolbox" - tks Cat and you too BadMemories.

Quote from: emotion overload on September 01, 2014, 02:53:47 PM
I guess it's depression, which is part of the CPTSD.  ...  I don't work, so you'd think my life would be in order.  But it's a mess.  I make the basic effort to keep the house clean enough that I'm not living in squalor, and I usually manage to keep the bills paid before they are late.  Other than that, I just can't get myself motivated enough to care about anything. 

It's particularly bad now, when I am not even interested in doing anything enjoyable.  Usually I at least like to read or watch tv, but there are plenty of days that I spend in bed, or just sort of staring off into space.  I have therapy tomorrow, and I don't want to go.  I don't want to talk, analyze, or work on anything. 

I do have good days, where I work frantically to try to catch up on the things I neglect.  But they aren't often or consistent enough for me to gain any traction.  I'm constantly in catch up mode. 

I think this is also the freeze part of CPTSD. 

BBM

This is a very old post I'm bumping. It's spot on for me atm and tbh most of the time. I bolded "I'm constantly in catch up mode" because my maternal grandparents were too and I sometimes wonder about the connection. I spent parts of my childhood with them. It just seemed part of life to never really be caught up on things.

I'm hardly working atm either but that doesn't induce me to do things like continue unpacking, make my apt home-like or even beautiful or make it feel safe or arrange it to have everything to hand which helps me strengthen my healthy, resilient paths.
Tho tbh I have done a few things today which help a little, like putting a few things away, flattening an empty moving box and throwing it on the pile, opened the window 3 times to let in sun and fresh air and one of those times even some music being played down below, unusually. That was much more common when I lived in the centre of town. I miss it. Shows me what all I used to help keep depression at bay.

I read the rest of the thread too and although there are exercises to help, I don't feel like doing any of them. I don't want people to start feeling sorry for me OR come up with suggestions OR think I want them to feel sorry for me. One reason I haven't reached out irl at all.

Some of the answer mbr emotion overload got from her T was helpful though and reminds me of what my current T says, though it's not quite the same. My T said ages ago that things will get easiER but not easy. Other people on here have been told recovery is possible and/or they show here in their posts that it is for them. They are them, I am me. For me it doesn't seem possible.

My current T has said it's good when I let everything fall by the wayside and 'do more or less nothing' (that's my description of it) because it means I can stop running from what's all buried underneath, even if it takes a long time to really stop running and to really feel. I DON'T LIKE FEELING. Sorry for yelling but it's the truth.

I dozed a lot today and read intermittently. Had a bunch of nightmares about FOO and current state of VLC. I did the more useful things after all that.