Out of the Storm

i was looking for something pos. to label this journal, and at the moment i couldn't find anything.  so, here it is.

at my last session, i found it difficult to talk to my T about what's going on w/ me cuz it felt like i was ripping a bandage off a wound that hadn't healed yet and everything ended up raw and oozing all over again.  i think that's why i've stayed away from writing here - it brings it all up again, everything i'm trying to pack down so it doesn't overwhelm me.

feeling fear is still so new, and so very awful.  i truly don't know how people have lived w/ it all their lives.  don't know how they've lived w/ any of their emotions, to be honest.  it still feels very new, extremely painful, and the hurt i've accumulated over the yearscan now slam me like a sledge hammer.  i know i couldn't have made it thru my life if i'd had them, tho. 

that's a tough realization for me as well.  but at the same time i can look back at everything and see how being unemotional saved me, even tho it took its toll on me and others in different ways.  ugh, that hurts to admit it.

i'll leave it there.  i don't want to go to mexico to live - that would be a very last resort.  too hot, too dirty (i lived in the desert), culture of poverty w/ its own unique perspective.  no, i really don't want to return to that.  and that sentence gave me the title for this journal.  i really don't want to return to where or what i was, so i'll keep pushing forward as best i can, thru the hurt and pain.

:fallingbricks:  i'm working on getting my faith in myself back.  it's gotten buried under everything.  knowing i can manage or deal with whatever comes my way has gotten me to where i've wanted to go in life.  didn't really have hope, but i had that faith in me.  it was a good thing to have and i want to feel it, know it, again. 

San,

This is an insightful post. I'm one who has lived in fear since birth. It is exhausting for sure.  I'm truly sorry you're feeling it now.

I know fear has a purpose. Fear, in proper doses, is the trigger for the Fawn-Freeze-Flee-Fight response. It drives us to finding solutions to unwanted situations. But while it is happening, fear is painful.

Over the years I've watched my wife and S1, both of whom are on the spectrum, boldly face life with less fear than me. But when fears do come up for them, I can see the struggle in their eyes. It's an emotion they're not used to dealing with.

On a positive note: Fear only lasts for them until the danger leaves. For that I'm envious. Fear seems to be my baseline emotion even on good days. They only feel it when it's warranted.

l hope and pray that your difficult situation leads to a good solution soon. I see why you don't want to move back to Mexico. Now that you've described the desert conditions and the poverty levels, I wouldn't want to move their either. But there are other solutions. I keep you in my prayers that a good solution presents itself soon, and that your faith in yourself becomes strong again.

:hug:

San, you are truly an amazing woman.  :bighug:

Lots of love to you, san  :hug: :bighug:

San, I resonate with the title of your journal.  I hope you continue to move toward what feels right for you.

PC, thanks for your response.  i know fear is also a signal that there's danger, which is why we take on one of the 4 F's, to keep ourselves as safe as possible.  the idea that i feel like i'm in danger now is awful, especially since i wouldn't let it come up to warn me in the past.  one thing about now is i think i feel safe enough w/ my D and lack of N's in my life to feel this emotion.  still, it sucks! :hug:

armee, you always say the most amazing things!  thank you so for your kind and generous words.  actually, when i read what you wrote the first half dozen times, i couldn't let them in.  they're so heartfelt, i could feel your sincerity, but could not take it in - still not used to feeling it from others.  my timing has been off for so long, i guess this time what you said truly hit me.   :hug:

bach, i so appreciated that love.  this, too, i was able to feel, but only after several times of seeing it.  i've blocked that part of me as well, and i think it's only beginning to thaw.  thank you for writing this.  it's wonderful, :hug:

rainy, thank you, i hope so, too.  i hope so for you as well. :hug:

reading what i've just read in response to everyone, this is part of not being able to feel my emotions - i haven't been able to feel the good ones, either.  like i've been living in a vacuum.  it's nice to be able to give a reality (or at least start to) to such wonderful sentiments expressed to and about me.  it's a little scary, actually.

Sometimes I don't know why I write what I choose to write San. There was so much pain and suffering in what you wrote and what you've gone through and what you are going through...your fear is incredibly legitimate as is the pain. But what just shone through to me through it all is how remarkable you are. You could have kept your eyes closed. You could have kept everyone and everything shut out. You could have fully given up. You've done none of that. You did what you needed to survive and you keep going slowly trying to peel back layer by layer to be a free-er version of yourself.

Here here! I agree with Armee,

San, you really are a remarkable person. Being able to verbalize what you're going through, and how you struggle with emotions is impressive. I agree with Armee, that it takes a remarkable person to be so insightful about your emotions.  My wife and son both won't do that. Neither will admit that they struggle with emotions. Neither is progressing into happier lives. Their emotional struggles are not being addressed. You're more tuned in than most people.

You're still in my prayers. I won't stop until things smooth out for you.

:hug:

armee and PC, i can't address this.  this is my third attempt.  thank you both for giving me these gifts.   :hug: :hug:

 :hug:

:bighug:

Gentle hugs, san. You are so brave for processing things that can be so scary. I am very glad you're here. May many more positive emotions come your way.

this is the first day i've been able to come here because of the 'privacy error' message i was receiving.

armee, thank you for that hug.  wonderful. :hug:

bach, loved that big hug.  thanks :hug:

CF, thank you for your kind words and well wishes.  those pos. emotions, yeah, they're kind of difficult to feel as well.  *sigh*  little by little, right? :hug:

we still don't know if we'll be allowed to stay in our apt., so that's continuing to bang on my mind.  i'm still having occasional anxiety attacks before bed, am always anxious once my D leaves the room.  it's got to be a trigger about something, but i'm not sure what.  abandonment?  being alone? not knowing how to be on my own?  i've got a pretty strict ritual once i come into my room so that i can settle and eventually, w/ the help of meds, fall asleep.  but i'm scared of lying in bed w/o falling asleep right away cuz of those ugly thoughts and rememberances that will grab me and not let me go.

i think the ritual is one way of feeling some kind of control, or i'd float out the window.  i still have so little sense of me, i think.  i've got therapy in a few, i'm sure i'll talk to her about it.

san, I'm hoping for certainty for you and your d on staying in your apt! :hug:

 :hug:

I'll look forward to a post-T update and will send hugs for now along with hopes for stability.

 :bighug:

blueberry, so am i!  we have a plan we think will work, but haven't been able to get to the office yet - no energy to take that on.  it's sitting in the back of my mind and slowly drains me each day.  ugh! thanks for your well wishes - much appreciated :hug:

thanks, armee.  i appreciate both. very much. :hug:

notalone, i love that big hug.  thank you! :hug:

my T and i talked about this nighttime anxiety issue of mine, and acknowledged that we've tackled it at least 3 times w/ emdr processing, each time w/ a slightly different angle or situation, and this time i had another, slightly different bent on it.  we've gone thru the coldness i felt when i was a child cuz i was never tucked in, never hugged and kissed before bed, the fact that hub #1 wanted to stay up late and party, and i'd go to sleep on my own w/ him being mad at me for doing so, my ex who had his nighttime ritual and rarely came to bed w/ me, and my mex. hub who'd fall asleep before me most every night cuz of working 12-hr. days.

so, being on my own at bedtime for various reasons incl. various people, and i'd get triggered when left alone while my D went to bed. my T took out my anxiety at night with one sentence - 'well, you do have c-ptsd.'  that made so much sense to me, clicked in my brain, and i haven't felt that anxiety for the past 2 nights.  what a difference one observation can make!  yay!!!  i consider it a win.

still haven't been able to get stability about our housing situation.  it's weighing on me, tho.  can't really get out from under it and don't know when my D will be able to do this.  she's been struggling lately, too.  so, we're still up in the air.  so draining.

Being up in the air with regard to housing is seriously destabilizing. Hang in there. It's all you can do. One day at a time for now.

There are so many different sources of your nighttime anxiety, all very valid reasons to feel unsettled. And T is so very right to say "well you do have cptsd." Right. It's complex...the origins, the fixes, the healing patterns....it's complex. Tonight when I go to bed I'll be pulling up covers around your shoulders, too, settling you in with maybe a stuffy and smoothing your hair out of your face and giving you a warm smile and wishes to sleep tight. You deserved that from all your caretakers, including exHs. 

Quote from: Armee on March 19, 2023, 05:56:18 PM
Being up in the air with regard to housing is seriously destabilizing. Hang in there. It's all you can do. One day at a time for now.

:yeahthat:

Seriously. I've just been through it, it was awful. + cptsd.

Your T has a large point, so does Armee.

Quote from: Armee on March 19, 2023, 05:56:18 PM
And T is so very right to say "well you do have cptsd." Right. It's complex...the origins, the fixes, the healing patterns....it's complex.

My favourite quote of the month.

I often have trouble sleeping. My T said that it is common with trauma.

Other than virtually, I haven't started looking for a place to live yet. Even virtual looking is super stressful. I really hope that you get to stay where you are. I hope you get a positive answer soon.

once again, you brought tears to my eyes, armee, and when i went to bed i could imagine being tucked in and cared about and it was lovely.  thank you for that image.  and thanks for the validation about going thru anything w/ c-ptsd.  i forget how much of a difference it makes, how much of an impact it produces, and how much more difficulty it can cause in anything remotely out of the ordinary.  so, yeah, big things, repeated things, are going to cause more than the usual problems.  :hug:

blueberry, you've done so great maneuvering thru your move, i commend you.  thanks for the support.  since i got to the states (well, that was a tremendous move in itself) 5 yrs. ago, i've lived in 3 different places already.  i actually cannot envision another move.  like my mind freezes at the prospect.  but, yes, one foot in front of the other.   :hug:

hey, notalone, i agree w/ your T.  sleeping is supposed to give us rest, allow our everything to regroup, yet at the same time it's also when our subconscious can run wild.  i've had a fear of not being able to sleep for so many decades, now, and that's playing a part here, too.  hopefully, that part is going into its own bag, cuz i really don't have reasons that i can't sleep in or go back to sleep or take a peaceful nap anymore.  sometimes it's hard to remember that.

and, i agree, even virtual searching can be extremely stressful.  best to you w/ all that.  thanks for you support.  :hug:

i was able to purposefully stay up to do editing last nite, and it was great.  normally, i'm anxious about getting to sleep, falling asleep, staying asleep, but i was able to put all that aside last nite and do what i wanted.  i slept well and long enough.  maybe i'm beginning to be able to look this dragon in the eye and say 'you have no power over me' (i know that was from 'labyrinth' but what the heck - it worked here for me!)

haven't had anxiety since fri. nite, either.  putting that concept in my head about having c-ptsd seems to have settled something down which had been restless and overwhelming.  so much fear around sleep for so long, so much aloneness surrounding it.  geez, at least w/ one-night stands, i usually had more touch, more validation as a woman, and more desire toward me than i had from all 3 hubs combined!  weird to think about it - where it was supposed to be a given, it was taken by their own crapola.

so, we still wait.  we have to get the paper from my D's friend saying she's employing my D, and i'm not sure when that will happen.  soon, i hope.  sitting on this uncertainty  is driving me mad!  ugh!  well, pretty sure we'll get what we need in the next two weeks, which will allow us to know if we have a place to live or not.  i'm frozen when attempting to picture what leaving here might look like.  frozen, yet it's still buzzing around the back of my mind that in a few months we might be homeless.  too much.

went to the office today and it sounds a bit more hopeful.  we were told that there were losses for apt. owners because of the pandemic, which is why rents are now getting jacked up so high as compensation, so to speak.  ugh.  i just hate this whole thing, but it seems like my D will be able to enter a projected amt. of earnings for the year, which they okay'd last year,  so it looks a little bit more like we'll be ok here.  still not totally in the clear for another month or so, but this feels better than the way it did.

my nighttime anxiety has still been kept at bay, which is nice for a change.  my D and i are in editing mode, so nothing heavy in therapy this morning.  i need my brain to function on words, etc,. rather than trauma.  it's a good distraction, actually, but i feel pretty tired.

Glad to hear there is more hope for staying in your apartment.

Trauma takes the language part of the brain offline, so good call on not dealing with heavy issues in therapy today.

thanks, notalone, for your validation.  it always helps to hear it.  :hug:

i'm i don't know.  vague, bloated, out of sorts.  my D had a panic attack 2 nites ago, i was up w/ her during the nite for several hours until she calmed down enough to go back to bed.  it completely up-set my system and it was her b-day yesterday so my routine was knocked out of the park.  need a few days to re-group.  off to the porch.

 :bighug:

I hope your routine starts to feel more usual soon.

armee, loved that big hug.  thank you so.  :hug:

thanks, rainy.  i really hope so, too. :hug:

my T told me something that i've been chewing on since yesterday.  i mentioned that i've had thoughts of D1 and wanting to reach out to her, ask her why i should respond to someone (she hasn't gotten in touch, this is just my own crap talking) who has been consistently critical, abusive, and disrespectful.  i just want to make this right between her and me.  i've been NC q/ her for over 8 yrs. and it still sucks at my insides every day.

when i told my T about this latest thought she told me the part of my brain that belongs to mothering (i'm paraphrasing) continues to hunt and search for any way to live up to its expectations of being a mother - basically to protect, soothe, and love - which i'm denying myself by going NC.  it feels like a vicious dilemma to tackle, yet it made a lot of sense to me.  i'm hoping that w/ some emdr processing next week i'll be able to somehow turn that part off - she's 45 now, has had plenty of chances to turn her life around, has had plenty of examples of willingness on my part to care for her when she's been ill or injured, etc.

all those reasonings are there, consciously, but getting rid of that primal mothering responsibility is a doozy.  i don't know how it might be done, but i'm willing to give it a try.  living like this has been a walking H***!  i was able to get some anger out about her yesterday, tho, which felt good.  several years ago i remember writing here that when i've been exceedingly frustrated, i'd go 'kill some zombies'. (plants vs. zombies game).  i did the 'whack a zombie' mini game yesterday, each one of those whacks was another spurt of anger.  it was great to remember that little trick i'd found for myself and bring it back into my present.

with a sigh, i think of my D1, and it's so sad.  my T told me there'd be at least 2 layers of grieving to deal w/.  not looking forward to that.

My heart is sinking with yours looking at at least 2 layers of grief. And as hard and painful as it will be, if it provides some relief from the day to day suffering it'll be worth it.

Quote from: sanmagic7 on March 25, 2023, 04:03:29 PM
when i told my T about this latest thought she told me the part of my brain that belongs to mothering (i'm paraphrasing) continues to hunt and search for any way to live up to its expectations of being a mother - basically to protect, soothe, and love - which i'm denying myself by going NC.  it feels like a vicious dilemma to tackle, yet it made a lot of sense to me.

That makes sense to me too. My Mom-heart is sad for the intense grief that Mom-San feels.

armee and notalone, thank you for your continuing support.   :hug: :hug:

i'm shaking right now, and it's getting worse.  earlier we were watching a british comedic show whose humor is sometimes a little rough, and i got hit smack dab in the face w/ one man describing . .. . .


TW*********************************  adult sex stuff  **********************************

that the way he'd like to leave the world was by masturbation and autoeroticism.  altho he wasn't planning to die, it is what i eventually found out my ex was engaged in for over 10 yrs. in our marriage.   when he finally told me about it (he'd seen a sex T, who sent him to SA, but really no other therapy around it - just sent him for the addiction) i was terrified every nite, even tho i didn't know it until way later, that i'd find him in our living room, dead.

after i moved to mex., he told me he no longer attended meetings, because they had no point for him since i'd left the marriage, which let me know he never really worked the program, nor thought he had a problem, except for me.  then i was terrified that my girls would walk into the house one day and find him dead. 

i guess it's no wonder i'm shaking right now, getting worse.  i've taken some meds, maybe will go out and have a cig, try to calm down.  i grew ramrod stiff when i was watching that part of the show, and was eventually able to settle a bit - it was dark in our room so my D didn't notice my reaction - and thought i'd be able to fly by this.  i'm berating myself for having this reaction now, like i'm conjuring up the memories on purpose and making myself feel terrible when i should be able to leave it in the past.

thought i could write it out here, get it out of me, feel better, but i just want to cry, my chest is so tight, and my being is vibrating.  cptsd.

 :bighug:

TW answer for others

Oh San, big hug from me. I know that feeling of real true worry that you will wake up and find a person dead. It is incredibly incredibly traumatizing. It doesn't matter from a neurobiological perspective that the worst case never came true because you lived that terrifying moment every single day for years and then worried about your kids walking in on their father like that. It's horrifying. Of course you are shaking/vibrating.

With the suicidality that's what I faced every day for years with my mom. I think it was hard to grasp the trauma because she never actually killed herself so theoretically everything was fine, alls well that ends well. But that ignores the extreme trauma of living like that every day. It's real San. You aren't weak. You experienced life threat "big T" trauma in your body every morning you woke up.

I'm trying to think now what helped me . Definitely her ultimate death by cancer helped to quiet that fear in relation to her, because it never went away for 35 years.

But I found I was still getting triggered by that trauma even after her death. In my case it was anytime I'd hear an unusual sound from my son's room (like a chair scraping across the floor when he'd get up from the computer). It wasn't until I had an actual flashback after hearing a sound from my son's room. I flashed back to lying in bed as a teen hearing my mom move about her bathroom in the middle of the night, and feeling how absolutely terrified I was wondering if she was doing it then, and if I should go check on her. This was not just a memory or "this reminds me of" kind of experience but a true flashback where I was actually there lying in my teenager bed rexeperiencing this.

San, it was horrifying to feel that level of terror now with the awareness I'm now capable of. It was in that moment that I could recognize my fears about the noises in my son's room were triggers, true trauma triggers and had nothing to do with the actual present moment. After that for the most part those fears about the present moment fizzled away and I only got the flashback that one time.

So it speaks perhaps to the importance of letting yourself feel that terror in its full horror, while also recognizing it as a thing of the past.

I have no idea if this is helpful but just I know it's horrifying. I know it's bad. I know it's trauma. I know too there's an exit ramp in our brains for this but it's mostly just a matter of time and serendipity when the conditions line up just right that we can find the offramp.

it was extremely helpful, armee, to be so validated.  it's the most horrible feeling i've ever felt, the most horrible situation i've ever gone thru.  decades of terror ensnared by this man wrapped around my throat.  thank you so much. 

TW

i also relate to the suicide thing, as i went thru those threats from her for years.  haven't gotten to that yet.

end TW

my other layer of terror stems from icky L, my first T who was also my employer and best friend - terrified she was going to dump me, so to speak, if i didn't do things her way (i saw how she worked), and the idea of losing all 3 of those important roles at once from my life felt terrifying.  so, i've still got some work to do, but i so appreciate your response.  thank you also for that big hug.  wonderful. :hug:

my T took time out of her weekend to talk me for over an hour yesterday.  i've acknowledged to myself that i'd felt terrified because of my ex's behavior in the past, but decades of it came crashing down on me at once and i was reeling under it.  never felt it before, not consciously, and it was so horrible.

that's all i can say right now. 

San, that sounds horrible. Your reaction makes total sense. Please be kind to yourself as you feel and react to those traumas. 

thanks for the validation, notalone.  it really helps. :hug:

i told my T  . . . suddenly i blanked, can't think of what i was going to say.  i think this is all too raw for me right now.

San

I am so moved by your reports. In the early years of learning about PTSD, I bought a copy of the DSM-V so I could try and better understand trauma. The diagnosis for PTSD can only happen if one of two things happen in our lives. 1) We have an experience that makes us believe we are about to die, or 2) We are connected with a parent, or partner, or spouse, or child, who we believe is about to die.

What you're feeling around your fear of walking in and finding your husband dead, and what any of us feel around fear of losing our children, spouses, parents is just as powerful a trauma as our fear of losing our own lives.

Yours, and anyone else's trauma memories and trauma reactions around a real and valid fear of finding our loved ones dead is valid and real. And terrifying. For people who've never faced death, death is a concept. For those of us who've faced death or the real possibility of death, whether our own, or our loved ones, death is very real. It moves to that part of the brain that goes from concept to reality and it stays there. So we live with the residual trauma of that from that day forward.

I'm SO sorry this happened to you. I am actually feeling the terror in my body right now. What you went through, and what any of us with suicidal loved ones have gone through are 100% trauma inducing and very deserving of our compassion and respect for each other's life experiences.

This is likely why so many first responders are PTSD survivors, and have their own suicidal ideation. They've walked in on too many frightening scenes. Death is real for them too.

Thank you for sharing this intimate part of your life with us. It's real and it's good that we talk about it.

BIG HUG!  :bighug:

Gentle hugs if you want them, san. Your being triggered by such a thing is completely understandable. You totally did not do it on purpose and simply because something is in the past doesn't mean it can't affect us today as we all know too well. We're here for you, san. Let those tears come if they need to.   :hug:

hey, PC, thank you so for all your compassion and validation.  it's truly appreciated.  :hug:

CF, i'm always welcoming hugs from you.  thank you for your care and support. :hug:

today i found myself in a 15-20 min. conversation w/ my D1, as if she were right in front of me.  i was trying to rest my eyes, and this popped out of nowhere, and i was caught in it and finally feared for my sanity, so i got up and moved around, and killed some zombies in order to get my mind off her.  last nite i heard the song 'in the arms of the angels' and relegated her to those, especially hoping she could find some 'peace and comfort there.'

the song kept running thru my head, and it was if she jumped in a accused me of writing her off, eliminating her or something.  it was a terrible conversation/argument we had, except it was only in my head.  it scared me so much.

my mind/brain is going nuts w/ this.  i thought i was doing the best i could, asking that she be taken care of cuz she doesn't want me around, and it was like she knew and blew a fit about it.  i'm hurting so bad right now.

 :hug: :hug:

 :bighug:

I'm here with you, right here, through this terrible grief.

thank you, blueberry, for those hugs.   :hug:

armee, you named this grief, and i checked w/ my T about that, cuz it never occurred to me something so crazy-making could be part of the grieving process.  she agreed w/ you, said it couldn't actually be placed in one of the 5 stages thing, but was part of it anyway.  thanks for being here w/ me.  it helped.  :hug:

2 days of those conversations w/ my D1, and it wasn't till i backed down on what i thought was a kind, caring thing, that she finally became quiet. these 2 days have been better.  this crapola is absolutely weird sometimes! 

 :grouphug:

I resonate with how weird this all this - so many ups and downs.

notalone, thanks for all those hugs.  they felt warm and wonderful. :hug:

rainy, yeah, it is weird.  it's hard to keep my feet under me when the landscape continually shifts.  thank you for that picture. :hug:

i'm feeling a little more like me today, but have been having a rough time w/ my D the past week.  her anxiety has ramped up terribly, and it's difficult to see her like this.  it's hard to know what to say or do cuz half the time it makes her more anxious, so i remain in a confused state.  i don't want to hover, but on the other hand i feel the need to be there for her, watch shows when she wants.  it's a lot like having a sick child - constantly on the lookout for what's going to help them feel better and making oneself available for whatever needs might come up.

honestly, if it isn't one thing it's a f******* nother!  it keeps me on alert.  i thought i was done w/ that after my D's were grown.  i didn't know how ill and wounded this one was.  it breaks my heart.  i just realized my emotions and thoughts about this are all over the place.  hard to get some sense of peace and rest when i have to be a caretaker.  it's like i resent it at the same time i'm so very glad i'm able to be here for her.  how does that make sense???

It makes 100% sense San to both feel resentful and grateful to be able to be there for her. I'm in a similar but less intense, less long term situation myself and as absolutely sincerely happy I am to be here to help I'm also tired and resentful too and deeply missing my own space. Both exist in sincerity.

It can't be easy to see your daughter appearing broken and more hurt than you imagined for her. I'll give you this maybe it helps, certainly you already know it, but a loving reminder: the fact she is willing and wanting to let you see that part of her means you have succeeded as a mom. Otherwise she would keep you at a distance and not expose that most vulnerable side and not want you around it. She's pulled you into that pain to sit with her because she trusts you. That's a great mom. Love and hugs to YOU.  :hug: And never forget she is her own person with her own pain and she has TWO parents. Her pain exists. It doesn't mean it is your doing. She wants you there with it. Just be. It's enough.

Having both of those feelings makes sense to me too.

You have a close relationship with your daughter. That she wants and allows your help and comfort says a lot about what a good mom you are. It is painful to see our kids suffering and not being able to make it better.

armee and notalone, your words gave me such comfort and so much validation.  thank you ever so.  sometimes it's difficult to see thru the neg. and realize what else is there.   :hug: :hug:

this resentment thing is new to me even tho i was in a similar situation w/ D1.  she had many mental and physical problems (aside from being abusive to me) and i never felt resentment at her ingratitude for everything i was doing for her.  never felt angry at what she was doing to me.  always excused her behavior as a result of her illness, didn't allow myself neg. feelings because of that as well.

just before i moved to mex., i began having nightmares where i would be physically and verbally fighting w/ my sister.  they were horrible, and when i woke up from them i'd have to keep myself awake (usually at the computer) for 3-5 hrs. before the images in my mind would finally fade away.  this happened for several years.

finally, at one point, it dawned on me that i was transposing my sister (who had also been abusive) for my D1.  i'd shielded my right to be angry at D1 for so long, but it was still there, hidden away in my subconscious.  when i was able to realize my sister was taking the place of D1 in those nightmares, they stopped.  immediately.  never came back.  but i was finally able to know i had a right to be angry w/ her for how she treated me, illness or not.  it was one of the biggest breakthroughs for me.

so, this idea of resentment toward my D is new, and has no connection to what i couldn't feel w/ D1.  it's just weird that i even mentioned it here - normally that would've been something i'd hide cuz of the guilt and shame attached to it.  and that just came up now - guilt and shame.  still having a difficult time being 'human'.  still having a difficult time recognizing feelings/emotions.  guilt and shame must come, yet again, from my F's expectations that i be perfect.  dang, will it never end!

san :bighug:

thank you, bach, for that big hug.  at this moment if felt soothing. :hug:

San, I don't know if this will make sense. I'm processing a bit as I write. Even when my children were babies there were times that I resented when they cried. Of course they cried, they were babies and had needs. I was just tired and worn out. I still loved them and wanted to soothe and care for them AND I was human and had my own needs (sleep) that weren't being cared for. Part of what I am growing in is the ability to be able to hold two seeming opposite feelings at the same time. For example, on my trip last year, I was disappointed that we weren't able to see a large section of the park and I was grateful for the beautiful parts that I was seeing. Both were true.

Bottom line is that it is okay for you to be human and have needs. That doesn't diminish your love for your daughter.

QuoteBottom line is that it is okay for you to be human and have needs

notalone, this is something i need to tell myself on a daily basis, i think.  thank you for reminding me.  it's still a strange concept to me, what with not having emotions/feelings for so long, so this idea is still pretty new.  i appreciate your example as well.  thank you so much - your timing was perfect! :hug:

doing ok, still struggling w/ allowing my D to be where she is, which is pretty terrible for her, difficult for me.  so frustrating that i can't help her.  talked w/ my T about it yesterday, and we flashed it to the point where i am now less stressed about it, because she has good people - me, T, her doc -  around her all looking out for her.  that was good to realize and took some of the burden off me.

It's good to remember that there are other good people caring for your D also.

I have a sentence written on my wall in chalk (the old fashioned chalk board chalk). It washes off with water. I thought of that when you said that you need to tell yourself daily that it's okay to be human.

thanks, notalone.  maybe i'll put up a poster saying 'iti's ok to be human' so i can see it every day.  what a grand idea.  thanks.  :hug:

just thinking about being human is kind of a mystery to me.  rules and regulations instilled from infancy (i'm guessing, but i believe it's true) have all been against my being human.  my T said my parents 'consistently dehumanized' me.  so, while i can tell myself it's ok to be human, i'm not always sure what that means. 

being raised like that is what i like to call a schizophrenic environment.  being forced to live 2 distinct ways at the same time.  living in both a reality and non-reality, while trying to make sense of both opposing perspectives and then functioning in them at the same time.  it's no wonder i was void of humanity w/in myself, and feeling confused at the same time why i wasn't able to interact well with others. 

on the surface, i was the life of the party, but i was usually drunk or stoned so not really me, and i could get alone, tell jokes, laugh incessantly, but i remember several times when i would get stuck if someone would ask me a direct question.  that still happens to this day.  luckily my D heard me attempting to make a doc appt., and when they asked for my phone #, i couldn't remember it, started looking for it.  she came to my rescue, told me to use hers.

i know lots of people don't remember their phone #'s but, to me, it's an example of being 'put on the spot' about something relatively easy to answer and grappling around inside my head to find an answer that will fit.  'how are you?' 'how are you feeling?' 'what do you think about so and so?'  at times those were all impossible questions for me to answer.  often, they still are.

so, to remind myself to be human, while i can put up that sign, i will often still rely on people here to define it for me.  it was someone from here who suggested i had alexithymia when i wondered about how many people were angry on my behalf becuz of an incident, and i was not angry at all.  honestly, it seems like there is always some kind of blockage to what might seem to be the smallest goal.  i'm so tired.

Quote from: Not Alone on April 05, 2023, 12:10:23 PM
Bottom line is that it is okay for you to be human and have needs. That doesn't diminish your love for your daughter.

:yeahthat:

Hugs to you san.

It's a new idea for me too, but when I read that whole post from Not Alone, it makes total sense. (Thanks Not Alone.)

thanks, blueberry, for your support and care. :hug:

***************** TW ******************  images and metaphors of being bound by past memories ************************




an interesting session w/ my T this morning has opened my eyes to the pain and hurt i've suffered at the hands/mind of my ex.  an image came to me of standing in our family living room entirely wrapped in razor wire, bound to the point that i couldn't get out of it by myself, and had no one to help me remove those metal blades from my skin.  i know my D would help me, except she doesn't want to hear anything bad about her F, so i've lived decades wrapped up, not realizing it, nor the wounds i've been struggling against.

my original question was why i continue to be so horribly triggered by anything, especially in the shows i watch (rom-coms, sitcoms, fun stuff) which are normally fluff and distraction.  when this image came up for me, it made me realize that those bonds were still wrapped tightly around me, and any suggestion of neg. relationship stuff would set me off, spinning, disturbed, distressed, full-blown flashbacks, and the added emotions and feelings i'd never had while it was happening to me.

as we did some emdr flash technique, i saw how those blades had been embedded into my skin, and any suggestion of what i might have experienced with him caused them to cut me over and over. it showed how very singularly trapped i've been.  i was able to think of my T as wanting to help me get out of those wires, and saw her w/ thick, heavy gloves gently unwrapping me from the neck down.  by the time i'd had enough, there was enough razor wire on the floor of our then living room to cover the entire space, and i still wasn't free, but i couldn't handle anymore.  we'll work on it again during our next session.

it was a revelation for me, the pain and hurt he'd enveloped me in by his lies over more than 3 decades of being in either our marriage or even after.  he took advantage of me, humiliated me, tested me to see how far he could go, and kept going farther because i didn't know enough to see what he was doing.  i remember him telling me w/ pride in his voice (after relating how he'd fooled his female therapist for over 1 1/2 yrs. into believing he was really a good guy) - 'i'm a great liar.' 

it still took me a few years and an incident w/ my D1, with which he was involved, before i decided i'd had enough and went NC with them both.  it was a terrible day for me, brought me to my knees, and i was ready to give up.  for unknown reasons, i'd begun receiving emails from  someone who had been making a study of NPD's, and i began researching in earnest.  fit them both to a 't', but at least i began learning what i'd been dealing with.

so, today, after the beginnings of the unwrapping, for the first time i felt some bit of hopefulness about getting out from under him.  it's a new feeling, one i'd not experienced before, but it felt good.  here's hoping i can get the rest of those blades out of me so i might have a chance to heal from those wounds.  i know it will take a while, but it's helped me understand why these triggers hit me so hard over and over, even after nearly 4 yrs. of working on NPD stuff.  insidious, to say the least.

Dear San, what a powerful image. If it helps. . . I would gently apply some soothing balm to the parts of your skin that were set free today.

I love Not Alone's suggestion.  :grouphug:

San this is massively hard to face what you are facing. You are so brave to face it, so strong to have endured what you endured finding a way through that preserved your life. You are also so very creative and I know you will find your way through this razor wire and pain to some healing.

San,

I agree with everyone here when I say WOW what a powerful image. I can almost feel it with you. Your image of being wrapped in barbed wire is a very telling image of how it truly feels to spend 30 years in the clutches of a narcissistic liar.

I feel the hopefulness that you describe in your final paragraph. It's sort of freeing that your brain is now able to see this for what it really was. A 30 yearlong entrapment. It's painful, but it's a fresh look. It takes all the responsibility for your bad feelings off you and puts it squarely onto your xh's razor wire.

I'm excited to hear how you and your therapist will be able to move forward with this now.

And, I hope you're able to do as NotAlone suggests, and give some nurturing, loving care to the thousands of cuts you are now unwrapping the razor wire from. I've fought off blackberry vines in my yard for decades, and what it has taught me is that with care and ointments, cuts do heal.

:hug:

notalone, an excellent idea.  my arms aren't quite free yet, but i do have some antibiotic ointment i'll be applying (and be able to picture my T applying it to my back) when i am completely free of this.  thank you for the suggestion.  love it!  :hug:

for the first time, at least w/ him, i also think a lot of these triggers will finally be diminished, armee.  thank you for your kind words and ongoing support. :hug:

PC, it was a surprise to me how the image took shape.  never consciously thought of it in such a way, but, boom, there it was.  i am feeling a bit numb right now after this visualization, and maybe that's a form of nurturing for the present.  i'll be returning to it Fri. w/ my T.  thanks so much for your support and care. :hug:

so, yeah, just kinda numb about it all today.  not in a bad way, but maybe in a way that a numbing solution was showered over me so i don't have to actually feel the pain and hurt - i think that would be too much.  flash technique might have taken the feelings out of the equation.  that's a good thing.  i can't imagine the amount of pain this might have incurred.

still waiting to hear for sure about where we'll be living in june.  we were supposed to have been sent the paperwork the first week of april, but it's not here.  so the tension mounts again.

i wrote before about feeling some resentment towards having to care for my D while she's going thru this horrific anxiety loop she can't get out of and i told my T about it.  she wanted to emdr it away, but i said 'no'.  for one thing, this feels more natural and appropriate to have this feeling, and i didn't want to get rid of that.  being new to feelings, it's like i wanted to do this as a human would.

for another thing, this is a sort of flashback to the days of D1, all the caretaking i had to do for her and never let myself feel anything like resentment or anger for how she treated me.  like i told my T, i've learned that just because you're sick and needy doesn't give you a license to kill. the difference between caretaking my 2 D's is remarkable to behold.  so, as much as i hate that my D is going thru this, it's provided me w/ a valuable realization.

i don't know how i've made it this far, this long.

I agree, that's very powerful! Hopefully you can take all our support and care as you unwrap that and envision it as cut-proof gloves. Gentle hugs as you unwrap.

I am thinking of you San.

thanks, rainy, i appreciate your energy coming my way. :hug:

went to the derm doc yesterday and it was quite tortuous.  had 2 precancerous moles burned off my cheek - i held it together a bit for the first one, but was overwhelmed by the pain of the second one, and sobbed and sobbed.  by that time, i was tightening up, as i do for protection against pain, and she found 2 more moles to remove for biopsy.  i told her/the tech that i don't numb well.  as usual, they didn't listen or dismissed it like i didn't know what i was talking about.

sure enough, not only did it hurt injecting the numbing solution in, but she gave it about an extra 5 sec. and began poking me w/ a needle. does this hurt? ow! yes!  another stab, another 5 sec. poke poke. does this hurt now? OW! Yes! 3-4 times i went thru this on each mole being removed, crying, sobbing in pain.  they tried to distract me w/ some squeez-y ball, tried to chat me up, i was having none of it.  No - i don't want that. No - i don't want to talk.  i was crying too hard from the pain to explain what i was doing to stand against the pain.

i used the word 'torture' twice, once after the doc asked me if i was ok. No! this is torture!  i have no patience for docs and the medical profession anymore, know their tricks, ain't falling for them or giving them what they want to hear.  her first question when she entered the office was 'how are you?  standard answer, of course, is 'fine'.  my answer instead was, 'not well, or i wouldn't be here.' it took her back, i could see it in her face she was unnerved for a second before regaining her composure. i don't go to a doc office cuz i'm 'fine'. i guess i'm one angry med. patient.

i'm still recovering from the whole thing today.  at one point i told them 'this is what trauma looks like.' asked if i'd been traumatized before in a medical situation, i gave one answer and she cut me off.  no more of that!

new topic.  so, after working on being wrapped in razor wire last tues., i spent 2 days running from the pain that i was sure i was going to be feeling and dreading it.  well, the universe works in mysterious ways, doesn't it!  looks like a lot of that pain manifested itself in the doc situation.  i was able to transfer the pain from my ex to this medical experience, and i felt calmer about it today (altho i still feel like i've been hit by a truck after tightening my muscles so much against the pain).  it's all still disturbing to me, but i talked to my t today, and she's leaving for 2 weeks, so i told her i'd be working on having her continue to help unwrap those razor wires from around me, and to put antibiotic cream on those cuts on my back where i can't reach.

i did a little of that today, but it's going to be work w/o her help.  i can't flash myself thru it, but i'll give it my best shot.  i did feel a sense of contentment today, something i haven't felt in 20 yrs.  it was when i was on my balcony, looking at my plants.  i sure hope we don't have to move cuz i'm gonna have to leave them behind.  for now, tho, they are my happy place.

 :hug:

San I'm so so sorry you had to endure a torturous level of pain multiple times at the doctor. And sad but not surprised the doctor did not listen and hear well when you spoke truthfully.

Your mind is amazing though - truly a remarkable one - to take the pain from the emdr sessions to the doctor with you for a weird release of sorts and I'm glad that helped with the razorwire pain!

You are one brave lady to keep working on unwrapping it! But these little gifts like feeling content for the first time in 20 years make it possible to see the possibility of real relief and so we keep going.

You really are amazing San and you deserve to feel better.

thanks as ever for your support, armee.   :hug:

i was like a dog who'd gone to ground yesterday, healing.  i could feel the open wounds on my body and just needed to stay away and still.  i could picture most of the razor wire being off, and salving my wounds, and the physical wounds helped me feel the reality of those emotional wounds from the image i was seeing in my mind.

i feel calmer today, a little less stabby, like the punctures are beginning to close back up.  this physical manifestation certainly put into reality what i'd gone thru w/ him, how much it had actually hurt me when i never felt it at the time, and how much pain he had put me in. i saw on a tv show last nite where someone's trauma re-entered their life, and the doc said 'the body knows' and something to the effect that the mind might push it down but the body never forgets. 

this experience was the epitome of what he said.  another thing, tho, is that i now feel more neutral toward my ex.  the killer hate i was holding has diminished.  it's like i don't care anything about him - maybe that's my mind's wish.  i'm not sure.  but my chest, where i've usually felt feelings surrounding him feels more concave, as in not filled w/ ugliness toward him.  we'll see if that lasts.  for now, it's good.

unfortunately, it's not totally true.  he's trying to arrange to come here to visit w/ my D next month, and as soon as i thought of that, my chest tightened up.  he might not be able to wound me anymore, but any interaction betw. him and her makes my skin crawl.  actually, wounding by proxy.  and i can feel anger lingering back there.  ugh!

I am so happy for some relief at least. How unfair for him to pop back up in your life right when you got untangled though. Wrap yourself in soft cotton batting so that any cuts he tries to make do not cause damage beyond the immediate point in time he is in your life.  Or a forcefield that prevents it from landing or some other amazing protection your mind generates. You can't protect your daughter, that's her job to figure out, other than support her. I'm sorry.

My husband couldn't protect me from the damage my mom was doing but the most supportive thing he said was that he would support me in walking away if that's what I had to do and he would understand and love me and support that decision. Coming from the culture he comes from that was a huge relief just to know he was truly on my side and I wasn't going to disappoint him. I'm not saying the same type of support is what your daughter needs, but just that support of me as a person took this huge huge weight off the whole situation.

armee, thanks so much for your protectiveness and caring about all this w/ my ex.  it feels so good. :hug:

my ex will not be visiting me at all - my D told me out of transparency that he's wanted to come visit all year, but that he'd stay in a motel and would not step foot in our place.  i just know how his mind works now, and i dread anything he says to her because i know there's an underlying agenda.  ugh!

well, the past 2 days have been pretty bad.  i realized i was not only dealing w/ the aftermath of the physical pain from the doc, but also w/ the aftermath of connecting that pain to the pain i never felt before because of what he's said, done, not said, not done   :blahblahblah:   it was disturbing my entire being and i felt the stress and distress of that within me.  besides which i have some raw wounds for real on my skin that won't heal for a couple weeks.  that also causes me disturbance.  while they don't actually hurt now, i can feel them, feel there is something not right or whole w/ me.

feelings these feelings/emotions after the fact and at this stage of my sensitivity is harder on me than i ever expected.  i really don't want to feel anymore.

Hey San.  :grouphug:

I'm worried about you this week. This will be tough no doubt. Even without physically being in the same space the proximity by way of your daughter's interactions with him and then her closeness to you brings his energy into your sphere. I know you can find ways to protect and heal yourself though. When you rise back up you find your way through with remarkable creativity and insight. Sending along hugs and love, cozy blankets, cozy drinks and stuffed animals to hug or throw depending on the mood.  :bighug:

Hi San  :hug: :hug:

I wanted to come here and just say I caught up on the recent journal entries and can tell you are going through so much. I can't possibly catch up on everything but wanted to read what I could.

I am hoping you are being gentle with yourself today and this week as you navigate all of it. Know that I am thinking of you and that EMS is also there if you need them.   :hug:

hey, armee, i've been worried about me this week as well.  dark places. feeling so miserable, so much emotional and mental pain.  thank you for your concern.  so appreciated. :hug:

hi, el, so nice to hear from you.  yeah, it's been a lot.  thanks for coming by and wishing me well w/ EMS.  love it! :hug:

don't know how i am this morning.  my ear has been acting up the past few days from the stress of this.  i'm very tired of living like this, in misery.  it dawned on me that not only was it miserable at the time, it's even worse now.  this has stripped me of most of the strength i've been running on.  honestly . . .

Hi San, thinking of you as you sort this out. 

Moving through it is worse than the numb way we experienced it. Yes. As you are in the dark forest of this though, is it ok if I remind you there's another side and you will come out on it? Each thing we move through. We come out. We feel better. We go back through with more baggage and repeat. Each time we get almost imperceptibly lighter.

Hi San.  :heythere:

I have been reading your journals San and I think it's really important you know how valued and appreciated you are.  Thank you doesn't really cover my gratitude for being here with you all.

I support you and stand with you as you are today.

:hug: if that's okay

A hug for you, dear san :bighug:

thanks, rainy - i so appreciate your support. :hug:

armee, as always, your words are wise.  thank you for them.  the problem i'm having is that going into this stuff is taking so much more out of me now, and i'm struggling to find my feet.  that's such a horrible feeling, along w/ the pain, and it's getting to me harder than ever.  w/ what my D is going thru adds to the burden, the struggle, the weight.  my knees are crumbling under me a little at a time. it's just so awful right now, i can't see the positives.  :hug:

hey, moondance, so nice of you to share such kind words and thoughts with me.  thank you. glad you're here.  hugs are always welcome.  :hug:

bach, i loved your hug.  thank you tons.  :hug:

am struggling so much w/ all this.  even tho the razor wire is coming off, metaphorically, it's gotten stuck by what i went thru at the doc's.  i'm still feeling the pain, and have even begun being grouchy at times, which is highly unusual for me to be crabby no matter what.  i have so many menial medical things to do each day now, and all they do is remind me that i'm getting old and unwell.  i've even been craving getting drunk as a way to get away from all this.

on top of my problems are those of my D, and it's more and more difficult to be attentive to her when she's walking around scared to death nearly all day every day.  plus, we still don't know if our lease will be renewed - we filled out the paperwork yesterday but have to wait for some of my financial info to come thru the mail.  and i feel those wounds on my body, i know they're there, see 2 of them on my face each time i look in the mirror, which i'm now avoiding.

i just want to cry, drink, smoke, and not give a flying frick about any of this any more.

 :bighug:

It sounds very heavy right now. It is very heavy right now. Keep doing what you can to feel a tiny bit ok, whatever that takes.

I so agree with Armee.

:grouphug:

San,

My heart is with yours today. Moondance has been helping me to focus more on the "just take care of today" concept. I love the words that we support each other and ourselves for who we are today. And today you are in a tornado of emotional winds, and many of us here are thinking about you with compassion and empathy. We each might be different tomorrow, so we can deal with tomorrow when tomorrow comes. Today, I send you a hug of support. I hope it helps.

:hug:

my friends, you have helped immensely.  armee, i'm getting thru it. my mood shifted to one of rage, which always helps w/ the darkness.  the immensity of what he did, never mind the flowers, the household help, the financial help (altho i suspect that could've been a lot more if he hadn't spent a lot on his addiction, which was covered up neatly by him ever so sweetly taking over the checkbook and bills.  oooh trust can be cruel at times).  thank you for being here w/ me once again. i'm feeling pretty needy right about now, so i totally appreciate you showing up for me even tho you have your own crushing issues to deal w/. i just can't do the same for you at this moment, but you're in my heart.  :hug:

moondance, thank you for your kindness and caring and all those hugs.  it was such a pleasant surprise to see you show up for me.  so appreciated.  one day i'll be able to reciprocate.   :hug:

PC, thank you for being by my side.  my mantra, for a long time has been, 'i've just got to make it to tomorrow'.  and the next day i say the same thing.  you hit it on the head w/ 'tornado of emotional winds'.  thanks for putting it into such elegant words.  i so much appreciate everyone's support.  it really is helping. :hug:

so anger and rage showed up now.  one of the things we're asked in emdr is what neg. emotion/thought do you have about yourself now re: this situation?  rarely do i have one of those.  i may have made mistakes int he relationship, but it was never to hurt, humiliate, deny, ignore, lie to, make a fool of, take advantage of . . . the list goes on.  i've had to stop watching anything to do w/ relationships - i'm too raw and everything is hitting me sideways.

i hate that man for what he did to me, and i refuse to take responsibility for his actions. 

Dear you have been there for me over and over and over. Taking time off from responding does not mean you are not showing up for me. You are right here. Thank you so much.

Anger is appropriate and motivating and pushes us forward and toward protection so I am so glad that is what you are feeling now.

:grouphug:

thanks, armee, for so much kindness. very appreciated  :hug:

the thought occurred to me this morning that i've completely lost track of my NN - i believe i was at 10 yrs. old.  i'd been working on that so diligently, and everything else ended up getting in the way and it was pushed to the back of the line.  i was so glad to be doing it, so sorry it's been lost for a while.  hopefully, i'll be able to return to it soon.

i also thought of this mental/emotional pain i've been experiencing since the doc, over a week ago.  it was one thing to recover from being in so much physical pain, but the unseeable pain has taken much longer to contend w/.  and i thought, is this all the pain i hadn't felt before from all the hurts from all the people or is this only from my ex and i'll have to go thru this again and again.  that thought smacked me between the eyes.  this has been so difficult, such a struggle to stay sane, it frightened me to think i'll have to go thru this for hub#1, D1, and icky L as well.

dang, i do not want to forsee a future of doing that.  this brought me to my knees - i haven't craved alcohol for years, so i know this was bad.  one can only hope. . .

It would be unbearable to go through the same level of pain on repeat. I think each time we go through processing something we learn little tricks that get us through easier the next time. I hope that is true at least. I think it is.  :bighug: if not you can always stop.

I appreciate you bringing up the distinction between physical and emotional pain.  For some reason that really resonated with me today.

Quote from: sanmagic7 on April 20, 2023, 08:08:32 PM
so anger and rage showed up now.  one of the things we're asked in emdr is what neg. emotion/thought do you have about yourself now re: this situation?  rarely do i have one of those.  i may have made mistakes int he relationship, but it was never to hurt, humiliate, deny, ignore, lie to, make a fool of, take advantage of . . . the list goes on.  i've had to stop watching anything to do w/ relationships - i'm too raw and everything is hitting me sideways.

i hate that man for what he did to me, and i refuse to take responsibility for his actions.

San,

I hate him too for what he did to you. I'm so impressed by your words that you made mistakes in the relationship also, but it was never to hurt, humiliate, deny, ignore, lie to, make a fool of, take advantage of . . .

There's much power in your posts right now. So much on your plate. I'm glad you have this forum so that you can at least express your situation to people who believe you unconditionally and at least you don't have to be emotionally alone with it all.

The connection between physical and emotional pain is stronger than most of us ever realize. My m used to criticize me for my stomachaches and headaches as a child by saying 'Oh! It's all in your head!" She was right, but she wasn't helpful. That was just a criticism meant to prove that my emotionally driven physical pain was my own fault. It was up to me to accept the abuse with a smile and stop letting it cause my very real stomachaches and headaches.  She would boobytrap me for future use too, by convincing me that if I EVER express any anger of any kind, I will die of a stroke right there on the spot. I'm 62 now and that truth is still so deeply burned into my brain that it won't surprise me that, if I ever do rise up in anger to protect myself, I just might die of a stroke as she taught me I would.  So yeah. I fully side with you that emotions absolutely drive physical wellbeing.

I hope there's no limit to how many virtual hugs we can pass back and forth, because I want to send more again today. Today is a new day, and it deserves another round of hugs and kindness from your friends here on the forum.

:hug: :hug: :hug:

 :hug:

 :hug:

thanks, armee. i was thinking of your words the other day, about how the pain might look from icky L, but i saw a very different image.  i had a rope around my neck, whether to strangle me or lead me around like my lap dog.  i would guess both would be pertinent here.  so, a very different kind of pain.  but i can see marks on my neck where it was rubbed raw.  yeah, still got some healing to do w/ that one. i so appreciate your support. :hug:  and thank you for that extra hug - it was lovely to see. :hug:

thank you, rainy.  i did find it interesting, the concept of how physical pain feels next to emotional/mental pain.  very different, very detrimental in their own ways.  :hug:

hey, PC, yep, i do know about that connection.  the 'it's all in your head' theme was even addressed by dumbledore.  it IS in our heads, but not in a dismissive way.  our brains connect all of us to each other, keeps tabs on what's going on, and if we can't express it verbally or by writing it, it will find a way to make our discomfort, distress, disruption known. 

thanks for the thought of unlimited hugs.  i love it!!!! :hug:

thanks for the hug, moondance and back atcha!  :hug:

something shifted.  i have been in such a dark place for so long, it's been truly difficult to see any light, but last night a shift occurred and i could see differently.  the doc experience was so awful, and even tho i got results of the biopsies back and they were neg., all i could focus on was 'i had to go thru all that BS for nothing!'. 

last nite, same as any night, i discovered a new train of thought. i'm 75, no major physical problems, can still get up and down the stairs (at one point i was using a walker, maybe 15 yrs. ago) do not have any physical dysfunctions that would land me in a hospital, have to put drops in my eyes 2x/day, but i'm not blind . . .and the list of what my body is still capable of at my age struck me and then i felt happy about it, happy for me, which i don't know if i've ever felt before.  it was new and strange, but very good.

today, i can still feel it, altho it's faded a bit.  but, it's still there and i like it and i'm glad and grateful.  i've felt gratitude before, but the happy never came with it.  so, this is 2 times in the past 6 months i've actually felt the happy emotion - the other time was about my D and what a wonderful person she is, how she's always been patient with and kind to me.  i'm giving this a big win.

 :hug:

This is a big win, yes, and one you've worked tirelessly to experience so kick up those fully functional feet and legs and enjoy!  :cheer:

Hi San,

That is great indeed.   

:cheer: :cheer:

:sunny:

armee, thanks.  i'm smiling.   :hug:

moondance, thank you for celebrating w/ me.  :hug:

still feeling it.  :woohoo:

I am grateful you are feeling and still feeling a shift.  :hug:

Yay for the shift! :cheer:

thanks rainy and blueberry.  i'm glad, too. :hug: :hug:

  it's still hanging on, but i had a setback today.  seems i'll have to go back to the derm doc cuz she didn't get everything the first time.  no cancer, but they want to get the residue she left behind.  ugh!  not looking forward to it at all, and i'll have to wait a few weeks, i was told.  my D is going to call and ask why the wait - why can't i get it done and over with!  my anxiety is not going to be pleased if i have to wait that long.  last time i had to wait an extra week to get my cancer taken out and my back seized up.  long story, but it was made more of a mess by seeing a doc and telling him i needed muscle relaxers.

anyway, this whole doc thing is driving me nuts, and i'm afraid it's only going to get worse the more i have to wait.   i hatehatehate this!

Hi SanMagic,
Sorry to hear that you've got a delay before you can have that further investigation done - I hope that your daughter is able to get some earlier change so you don't have to wait so long.
Just wanted to send you a supportive hug.   :hug:
Hope  :)

thanks, hope.  i appreciate hearing from you, and love that supportive hug. :hug:

i've put a call in to find out why i have to wait.  no response yet.  i felt my anxiety spike last nite and was way up there already today.   :aaauuugh:

Hi San,

I hope you receive a quick and supportive answer to eleviate the anxiety San.

There is strength in numbers and we are here with you and for you.

:hug:

I hope they can get you in soon now that they know how difficult it is to stretch it out and prolong the pain and distress.  :grouphug:

moondance, i so appreciate the support.  thank you. :hug:

armee, we'll see. thank you as ever for your care and concern.  :hug:

i went full monty (so to speak) on the woman i talked to about procedure and waiting and having this wound heal before making it an even bigger wound (which makes no sense to me) and how my anxiety and stress levels are mounting at the anticipation of the next procedure and that isn't going to help w/ any kind of healing.  my voice was breaking, i was near tears, and when she mentioned something about leaving less of a scar if they wait, i went off. 'i don't give a **it about a scar, i'm 75 and not going to be in any beauty pageants anymore, i just need this done with!'

so, supposedly the doc is going to call me tomorrow.  i'm beginning to stiffen up in my neck and shoulder after that call and am completely wrung out,  one step, then another . . . and this is the latest in doc traumas i've gone thru, so i'm even more sensitive, i think.  i wish i could just calm down and be patient and take it in my stride.  looks like i can't.

 :bighug:

How dare they make you feel like it is you not being able to take this in stride. This is on them. I totally get doctor trauma (have some horrible stuff myself there that I can't even speak about). And yes that does ratchet up the emotions more. But it is not in the slightest bit unreasonable not even a little to want to have this second part done sooner rather than waiting for it to heal and then go digging around again. They are being cavalier about this.

And the fact they changed their story from "soonest we can fit you in" to "oh this is on purpose so it doesn't scar" ugh that duplicitousness has me shaking in anger for you. You deserve the respect of truth and to be able to make your own informed decisions and to not be made to feel like you are the one overreacting. I'm sorry San. It's not ok. I'm sorry you have to face this again.

I'm proud of you though for taking your power back and standing up for what you need and how you feel. That heals.

Ugh. So sorry you have more to go through at the dermatologist.

thank you for your anger on my behalf, armee.  you brought tears to my eyes. :hug:

you're right, notalone, ugh is correct.  thanks for being here w/ me. :hug:

long story short, i was able to get the procedure done today.  lots of meds for me, lots of differences on their part.  they used a topical numbing agent first off (which i had asked for last time but was told they didn't have it), and i had a bit of a run in w/ the doc about pain vs pressure.  i asked if she could try seeing how numb it was w/o a sharp object, and she said, no, this numbing only responds to a sharp.  in my mind i thought this is such BS, but i was on enough xanax this time to stay a bit more together.

i suggested she use a finger, and she pressed on the wound and i said 'it still hurts'. she kept telling me i'd feel pressure, and then i kinda lost it. i told her i know the difference betw. pressure and pain, and what i'd just felt was pain.  she had been trying to convince me that their numbing agent worked almost immediately, and i told her again it takes me time.

:pissed:  why the frick don't docs listen to me?  so annoying, so threatening to anticipate any next visit for whatever reason.  at any rate, it eventually went well and easily, but dang, i'm so tired of fighting for what i know to be true and real!!!  so, it's over now, thank all the powers that be.  oh, and when she first came in, she asked me how i was, and i said 'not good', and she put on a frowny face and said, 'too soon?' and i said no! i want this over with.

o my dear heavens, is it any wonder i get so worked up over doc visits?  9 times out of 10, this kind of crapola has happened.  lord it over me like they know better than me what's going on w/ me, how i respond.  she told me she wanted to see me in a year for another full body scan, i said, 'we'll see.'  i can't even think about that.

so, i'm alive, mostly well, my leg itches where the stitches are (which i fought against over and over and she wore me down, so i got them).  i didn't have enough strength to fight it anymore.  i'll take them out myself in 2 weeks.  i'm so spent.  i'll feel it more tomorrow, i'm sure.

Ohhh San I so wished that you would be heard/believed the first time.  It is absolutely unacceptable they not honor your requests; it's your body, you know how you feel, how it feels when they press down.

Gosh I really dislike doctors a lot.  I have not had good experiences either.  I so get it.

I hope your able to sleep, rest up and heal from this now that it is over.  Thank goodness for that.

:bighug:

San, rest well. The interactions with the doctor sound utterly maddening. Tend your wounds, get lots of sleep, and good nutrition. Im here with blankets, tea, fresh bread for a break when you need it.

I'm so glad you're getting to feel that way, san!  It's encouraging! :hug:

Quote from: sanmagic7 on April 28, 2023, 06:02:15 AM
:pissed:  why the frick don't docs listen to me?  so annoying, so threatening to anticipate any next visit for whatever reason.  at any rate, it eventually went well and easily, but dang, i'm so tired of fighting for what i know to be true and real!!! 

Feeling  :pissed: for you. You deserve to be listened to and heard!

I resonate with feeling unheard by medical providers.  It makes me want to not go.

thank goodness is right, moondance.  thanks for your support and that big hug - loved it!. :hug:

thank you so, armee.  i'm am on that break as we speak.  i appreciate your offer so much. :hug:

it is encouraging, bach. mostly encourages me to know these 3 1/2 yrs. of therapy are causing changes in my neural networks and trauma responses.  even if the 'happy' feeling doesn't last long, i really enjoy it when it's there.  thanks for your support. :hug:

notalone, thanks so much for your anger on my behalf.  it's so validating and i love knowing someone agrees w/ me. :hug:

rainy, no kidding!  i dread going to docs, put it off till i can't anymore.  not only do i not want to go, i get a rebellious streak in me afterwards and i don't want to follow up on their suggestions for self care!  i usually am able to calm down and go ahead and do what i think is important infection-wise, etc. but it just brings out a beast in me.  thanks for your support. :hug:

so, i'm now in recovery mode.  i'm doing what i'm supposed to for tending my wounds to prevent infection.  it's put me out of sorts knowing i have these 2 open wounds on my body, being able to feel exactly where they are.  a little unnerving, but i'm discovering just how very sensitive to everything that's out of the ordinary i am.  it's kind of a realization, but one that helps me not be frustrated by it, so it's a good thing.  it's just the way i'm built now.

very tired today, tho.  this took it out of me these past 2 weeks.  looking back, tho, it's been a rough few months.  it would be nice to have some smooth sailing for a while.  i could dig that.

san, I'm sorry for what you've had to go through in the past little while with doctors, especially them not listening to you, believing you :pissed: :pissed:

I know that little rebellious streak you mentioned, so good on you for doing the self-care atm anyway :applause: :hug: :hug:

Hoping for some smooth sailing for you for a while :witch: on a broomstick?  Or here's an :umbrella: to shelter under?

blueberry, definitely on a broomstick, as i can be quite the witch when i need to.   :witch: we're spirit sisters!  so thanks for that, for picking her out.  just right!   :hug:

not much to say.  i can feel within how the stress of all this has gotten to me.   :fallingbricks: my T should be back tues., but i can't really rely on that cuz she's been getting sick feeling about once a month since she had covid.  my gut feeling is it's long covid, and i can't imagine how she's going to feel after 2 weeks in europe.  hope for the best.  there's so much to unload on her.

I know about the rebellious streak too, san, but thank you for your efforts to take care of my friend  :hug:

:witch: I never noticed this icon before but she tickles me! 

i agree, bach. i think she's a hoot!  and it really fits me.  and thank you for your concern. :hug:

the stress of the past month has physically taken its toll today.  my ear plugged up from the inflammation my body produces under prolonged stress, and it's been quite painful at times.  it's like stress flu - i just need to rest for a few days, keep taking the proper meds, and it will eventually calm down.  one time this happened, it took 6 mos. to clear up.  just one more thing.  so very sick of feeling miserable.

my wounds are being taken care of, but of course i've got that little niggling thought in the back of my mind about not having taken care of them correctly till a day later, infection, another doc visit, etc. etc. etc.  will this never stop!!!?

 :bighug:

thank you for that big hug, moondance.  it just allowed me to take both a big inhale and exhale, letting some stress out.  loved it!  :hug:

 :bighug:

One more from me, too.

It feels really good for me as well Sanmagic, to be able to give a hug in a safe place. 

:hug:

armee, i'll take it. so beautiful. thank you. :hug:

i agree, moondance.  it's very nice to be able to do this :hug:

stress flu, ear clogged, moving very slowly.  miserable.  will this never end?  i'm sick of coming here and all i do is complain about how bad i feel.  i think i chucked one good thing in here about feeling happy and grateful, but when i get to feeling like this, all the other good things go away.  hate it!

Hi SanMagic,
I am so sorry to hear that you're not feeling very well, and I hope that you find some comfort somewhere in the day - I want to pass some warm blankets, if those would help, and perhaps sit with you and enjoy a warm sip of some comforting drink that might help - maybe sniffing some eucalyptus, as that can sometimes clear passages a bit.  Whatever helps you, I hope something does.  Horrible when you feel bad - yucky feeling. 
Take care,   :hug:
Hope  :)

 :hug:

Dear San. Hey, it's OK. It's OK to come here and tell us how bad you feel right now. I am so sorry you are suffering again. But you are, and pretending you are not is just a form of self denial so please keep telling us when you feel this way so we can support you through that.

I love reading the days you are joyful and feel well and it's more than just one time. And once this stress flu lifts and the wounds have healed I trust you'll find a spark of joy again. And then you'll move on to conquer the next joy blocker. You are quite amazing and creative as you go through this process. I'm in awe of you, San.  :grouphug:

I'm sorry your aren't feeling well. You may feel like you come on here and only complain and say how bad you feel, but that simply is not true. You have personally given me a great deal of kindness and understanding. AND it is okay for you to tell us what is happening with you. I don't see it as complaining.

I welcome you coming here to share whatever your experience is. 

hope, i loved the thought of sharing blankets and time together. thank you. :hug:

armee, as always, thank you for your kind words.  i appreciate you so much.  :hug:

notalone, thanks so much for your encouragement and acceptance.   :hug:

rainy, thank you for your welcome no matter what space i'm in. :hug:

it's going by inches, as usual when i get this 'flu' from stress.  i was able to do laundry today, but after i folded it, i collapsed in a heap into my chair, completely wrung out.  this has happened so many times.  too many docs, arguments, explanations, hysterics to get what i needed, standing up for myself when i shouldn't have to . . . and the pain, both the physical and emotional pain i've experienced in the past few weeks.  it seems like it's been months.

still under the weather, but hoping to have some energy by the weekend.  my T also cancelled yesterday after being gone for 2 weeks.  i was hoping to emdr away the trauma from the doc stuff.  kind of ticks me off - she'd been on vacation for 2 weeks in europe, and even said in her email she should've given herself more time to regroup.  she's cancelled a lot this year due to feeling crummy.  that was wearing, too.  angry about it, even tho this is the first time i said it aloud.  my D's been saying it since yesterday when she heard of the cancellation.

i'm just too sensitive now to take anything untoward in stride.  that's how it feels.

i've also been doubting my posts lately, worried i've been rambling both here and other places.  my head space just isn't right.  i want to say more than just send a  :hug: to someone, but i think i need to stick w/ that for now.  the anxiety about what i'm writing is getting to me.

San, I am sorry to hear about your T's uncertain schedule - it makes it hard to feel support when that happens. 

 :bighug:

Feel better soon, dear San.

It's OK to be angry at your T for uneven availability. Even if her absence is justified it is still difficult on clients. I feel angry because my T is often gone back to back to back with a week free here or there. It makes it hard. I feel angry even though I know it's what he needs to be able to be there at the level he is there for me and other clients when he is around.

I hope she's back at it next week for you to process.  :hug:

I would have a hard time if my T cancelled often.

 :bighug:

 :bighug: to you Sanmagic

rainy, thanks for the support and validation :hug:

armee, thanks for your support and encouragement. loved that big hug :hug:

notalone, thanks for your support and validation :hug:

PC, loved that big hug and your support :hug:

Moondance, loved that big hug and your support :hug:

i'm not fully better yet, but had to come here to drop the load i'm dealing w/.  My ex got into town today, my D is still with him. i saged myself against any of his vibes that she might bring home, and imagined a crew of angels standing between her and him.  i thought i was managing the news, but when it got real today, i flew into a huge EF and am so very upset right now.  it brought back his unclean thoughts toward her.  she assured me he would do what she asked about testing and wearing a mask, but i don't trust him for a minute.  he's already bragged to me about what a great liar he is.  i so hope he doesn't get her sick or spew his crapola anywhere near her.

wow - this hit me harder than it thought.  i'm not out of the stress flu yet, but this heaped more on me.  i'm struggling. i understand she has to go down her own path, which includes keeping him in her life, and he told her he'd talk w/ her about helping her financially. i hope he does, gives her what she needs to help lessen the anxiety and stress she's carrying around about it. it was a big move for her to even ask him for help.

i don't know what to do w/ this.  i still need rest, but this isn't giving it to me - quite the opposite. when will this crapola end?!!!

I so resonate with all the stress and EFs and letting others walk their own path.  I have no idea how we do this, but I am here with you.

 :hug:

Acceptance, I think, right now. Acceptance that this is extremely difficult and upsetting. Of course you feel awful. I dont even know if I'd call it an EF. It's also present currently. This is both past and present right now. EF for reliving what he put you through and very current mama bear inclinations to protect her- from his creepiness, potential illness, and his lies.  :grouphug:

oh, rainy, i don't know, either.  somehow we do.  i haven't asked her any questions, she's volunteered little.  she knows this is difficult for me, i'm sure, and it's stressful for her.  thank you for your continuing support  :hug:

armee, you hit it on the nose.  past and present.  i brought it up to my T, she said it's not therapeutical wisdom to try to do any processing w/ that situation.  i told her i didn't want any, but was looking forward to next week when he'll be gone and i can do some kind of mind cleansing.  she thought that was a good idea.  and, acceptance, yeah.  thank you so much for always being here for me. :hug:

yesterday was a pretty stressful day for me.  don't know exactly why it was more so than the 2 days before.  he's still here, will leave fri.  i was edgy all day, distressed, feeling disturbed, yeah, like there was a disturbance in the force for sure.  my D was a bit needier than usual, so i could tell this is wearing on her as well.  i think i've kept my distress at bay enough, tho, that she's not feeling bad vibes off me, so that's good.

i've also been smudging myself while she's gone as protection against any of his vibes she might bring back w/ her.  i can't help feeling something's wonky w/ him, tho.  yesterday when she was leaving (she usually wears t-shirts and leggings), i mentally told her not to walk in front of him cuz he might be checking out her butt.  it's terrible how much lingering beliefs from trauma have grabbed on and held. 

my heart is racing now just writing about it.  i'm gathering up my angel crew to put between them for protection, and will smudge myself later, too.  he leaves tomorrow, but it feels like it's getting worse for me as time has gone on.  happily i talk to my T tomorrow morning.  ugh, my gut is roiling.

Everything you are feeling makes sense for this situation. There is nothing wrong with you for feeling this way. I know you know that I just want to reiterate it. You feel bad because it's a bad situation. I can't wait for him to be gone again.  :grouphug:

thanks, armee.  i can't wait, either.  tomorrow morning.  one more day.  :hug:

i took my stitches out this morning from the one wound, so that's done, i'm proud of myself, and glad to be rid of them.  my being feels more able to heal now from this ordeal.  got a note from their office telling me to return in 6 mos. for another mole check.  no, i don't think so.  not w/ that doc, anyway.

just making it thru today.  really looking forward to having him gone.  hope this never happens again.

I'm sorry san for all you're going through with ex being there. I want to say: "How dare he!?!"
:bighug: :bighug:

thank you so, blueberry, for your indignation and support.  and those big hugs are so appreciated.  :hug:

Thinking of you San, so glad for you that he is leaving tomorrow.

:bighug:

I hope it never happens again, too. I hope the repercussions if any of his visit are short-lived.

I'm so glad you got those stitches out!

:bighug:

thanks, moondance.  he's gone now, and this morning i felt like a great pressure was lifted.   :hug:

armee, me, too!  thank you for that big hug - loved it! - and for your support as always.  :hug:

as i said, this morning felt like a great pressure has been lifted from my heart? being? soul? but something lifted.  i did find out that she didn't spend as much time w/ him as i thought, so i was glad about that.  otherwise, no real details except he's going to help her out financially, which she desperately needs.  she was also glad to have me back in the passenger's seat while she delivered food.  that felt good.

i did some mental/emotional cleansing yesterday w/ my T - we knew he was gone at 9 cuz my D came home, so we had 10 min. to do some flashing on getting my mind a little cleaned out.  i focused on a shell wind chime i got in mexico, cuz mex. has always been my safe place, and imagined those shells trying to figure out what was the best way to get rid of him.

first they tried covering him up w/ sand, but it didn't work.  then they tried scraping away at him, but too yucky.  finally, they built a sort of wall out of themselves between him and me, and began advancing on him, pushing him backwards away from me.  they kept doing this until they were able to push him into a mighty black hole, and the last image i saw was of him falling backward into the abyss, arms and legs flailing.  it was satisfying.

so, onward. 

 :pissed: my t canceled again - again! - yesterday and i was really looking forward to helping me emdr thru my fears concerning the heat, leading back to when we first moved in and hit a tidal wave of hothothot!  absolute trauma - i thought i was going to have to be sent to the ER in an ambulance twice - we moved here w/o fans or a/c.  long story short, i was taking showers in my clothes and putting ice packs over my head and heart.  we did get fans, but my D had to call the place where we'd ordered our a/c, tell them it was a medical emergency that we get it sent immediately. 

it was a harrowing exp. and a few days ago when this heat hit, i felt so disturbed somewhere inside i didn't know what to do w/ myself.  the nite before i realized my chest was tight, which is my cue to fear. i was terribly scared from the other experience, but had to push it down so as to be able to think about what to do for myself to survive. so, after the notice i wouldn't have therapy, i decided to do some emdr flash on myself.  of course, that brought up feelings of having to do for myself one more time.

what came up while i was doing it was very reassuring, and resolved the fear.  it centered around being w/ my D now, that she's got my back, and she would do everything to keep me safe.  finally i have someone in my life who consistently will have my back.  it's a good feeling.

my wounds are healing and that feels good.  all band-aids are off.  now it's up to nature to do her thing.

i survived my ex's visit.  it wasn't till the day after he left that i felt that sense of relief.  i also think my D spent less time w/ him than i thought, which felt good.  i can't imagine what it must have been like for her to be around his energy.  ugh!  enough of that.

we also got a notice yesterday that our paperwork for the apt. has been approved, so we're going to the office today to sign the papers for another year's lease.  i haven't gotten a true sense of relief yet - feels like i've been living on the edge of this for too long, dreading the idea that we mite get kicked out.  won't really feel it till the papers are signed, possibly.  at any rate, it looks like that part's off our plate.  thank you to all my angels looking out for us!

my little balcony garden is coming along.  so very happy about that.  we've had flowers this spring, and are now going for a few veggies, maybe a melon.  hot diggety!!!  i can write hot diggety!!!, but i don't feel it. 

so, lots of positive news for me.  am finding it hard to take it in, feel the goodness.  it feels like part of the old me who didn't rejoice about good things coming my way.  instead, taking it for granted in their acceptance.  another lump of stuff inside me. it's a strange feeling in one sense, but one i've felt so many times over so many years.  maybe i don't know how to rejoice inside me, maybe it's all about taking the good things in stride like i take the bad things in stride.  i just acknowledge it and move on.  sad way to live a life, i suppose.  maybe that's why my eyes have held noticeable sadness forever.

did some financial stuff the yesterday, signed the lease, and tears started.  don't know why, don't know how many emotions or even what they were wanted to make themselves heard, but it caused me to be wrecked the rest of the day.  did a lot of sleeping and feeling crummy.  i'd just gotten over the stress flu, which lasted at least a week, had a good day or 2, then it happened again yesterday.  happily, i feel better today.  i'll explore this w/ my T in a few minutes, if she's around.

wow - i hated putting that caveat about my T, but it came out, so i guess my trust in her being here is pretty low.  i don't like feeling like that.

San, this week I was speaking strongly about someone and a friend said "That is your experience, so don't worry about complaining."  For some reason that helped me. 

I like that too, Rainy.

San,

I hope T was able to be there for you today.  :grouphug:

A lot of times when there's some relief for me and things let up that's a time when it all catches up with me and knocks me flat. I imagine something like that could be happening with exH gone and the lease signed. (Congrats on that stability for a bit). Stay cool, love.

gentle hugs if you want them, san. It's definitely awful to be sick on top of all this.

Quote from: sanmagic7 on May 19, 2023, 02:48:01 PM
did some financial stuff the yesterday, signed the lease, and tears started.  don't know why, don't know how many emotions or even what they were wanted to make themselves heard, but it caused me to be wrecked the rest of the day. 



  i'll explore this w/ my T in a few minutes, if she's around.

wow - i hated putting that caveat about my T, but it came out, so i guess my trust in her being here is pretty low.  i don't like feeling like that.

The tears make sense to me. The stress that you carried of not knowing if you had a place to live was huge.

If my T cancelled often, I would have a lot of feelings about that. Your feelings and level of trust are valid. It's okay to feel what you feel.

rainy, i've read your response several times, and only this morning did i understand it and how it pertained to me.  unfortunately, my brain can't always make the connections for written or spoken sentiments.  thank you for this - it does make sense to me now.  and also helpful. :hug:

hey armee, yeah, T was there, and i was able to tell her how upset i was that she wasn't there before.  at the end of the session, she told me she's also angry at my sick-y T.  it was nice to hear.  unfortunately, she seems to have long covid, so she's susceptible to bouts of feeling unwell.  it sucks.  and you described it exactly - i've often had a crash after the storm has passed and things are calmer again.  thanks for your support. :hug:

CF, hugs are always appreciated.  thanks for yours.  and, yeah, the stress flu is directly caused by the prolonged or intense stress of a situation or more than one.  this has been happening to me for about 40 yrs., so i'm familiar w/ it and know that i need to rest, do as little as possible, and be patient.  it usually goes away in a week or two, but it's just awful feeling when it's hit me.  much like being on the verge of getting the flu.   :hug:

notalone, you are correct.  the tears told me i didn't realize how huge that load of stress was.  well, i never do, actually, until some sort of reaction like this.  and thanks for the encouragement of my feelings, no matter what they were.  i was able to tell her, she accepted it graciously.  that felt good. :hug:

my D and i talked about finances yesterday, and once again, it doesn't look good. she's too stressed/anxious to do what she was doing before, is doing a delivery service now but is unable to work enough hours to make the money she needs for her part of the bills.  she's working on some stuff, (also has a disability account going, but that won't be settled until maybe next winter sometime) to bring in more money, but honestly, it totally freaked me out yesterday.

i ended up doing some eye movements and what i came up w/ is to rely on faith that this will work out.  we've had angels taking care of us this far, and i need to draw on that to somewhat calm myself down.  i swear, one thing gets settled, another threat presents itself.  i don't like living like this.  i'm more and more sensitive to the slings and arrows of life as this keeps happening, which too often sends me to dark places and it's getting harder and harder to continually pull myself back up.  this one is weighing heavily on me right now.

 :bighug:

thanks, armee.  i needed that.  :hug:

It breaks my heart to read this and makes me angry that the wait for disability payment is so long.

I do have faith in your faith though, that things will work out. You do seem to have lots of angels at your side. Which reminds me of one of my fave songs...angel flying too close to the ground.

:bighug:

You have been one of my angels.

big hugs, san. As someone in the disability process, I totally get how aggravating and unfair it can be. I also get how sometimes you just have to let your Higher Power take the lead. Wishing you health and peace.

Sending love and good wishes, san  :hug: :bighug:

San, I am thinking of you as you and your D sort through this the best you can.

Hi San,

I hope for you and have faith that it will in fact work out.

:hug:

the support from all of you is so wonderful and heartwarming.  thank you :grouphug:

thank you armee, for your kind words.  here's hoping on the disability - it's going to go before a judge this time - she's been turned down twice already - so there's still no guarantee.  it's been a nightmare of waiting, scrambling for money, hoping against hope twice already that she'd get accepted, which she wasn't.  they don't favor mental/emotional illness, and it sucks. :hug:

thanks, CF.  yeh, that's what having 'faith' is all about for me.  something else has to take care of it cuz it's out of my hands.  i've been in a lot of funky positions before, but now i'm too old to just let it go w/ no worries.  faith has been tried, tested, and thrown into the fire so many times, it's more easily overcome now.  it's tired. :hug:

bach, thank you.  loved those hugs.  :hug:

thanks, rainy, for keeping us in your thoughts.  :hug:

moondance, thank you for having hope on my behalf and the extra amount of faith.   :hug:

talked to my T about all this yesterday.  it's so frustrating for both of us that all my trauma work has been put to the side for so long cuz all this crapola keeps coming up and getting in the way.  my sensitivity to everything is so out of hand, i can go into a tailspin at the drop of a hat.  it's like my reserves have finally been used up and i need support and reassurance that what i'm feeling/thinking is true.  mentally, i'm barely remembering things from one hour to the next.  it's a crappy way to live, and i'm not enjoying it.

some good news is that an author friend of my D's is going to make monthly payments toward having her next book edited, etc., so it looks like we'll be able to pull thru to the end of the year.  i just want to cry.  all the brainwork of trying to figure out who we might be able to hit up for financial help - which only included a few members of extended family, and most of them are now retired so there really wasn't much hope there - and the end of the stress this has put us under knocked us on our proverbial buttocks yesterday.  i'm still not totally ok today, need to take this day off as well.

last nite, watching big bang theory, of all things, i got triggered so badly, i had to leave until the episode was over.  it was about howard being more interested in his fantasy women than in his girlfriend and i was so taken aback when the fantasy woman said to him - so why are you here, doing this, when you have a real woman who wants to be with you?  that tossed me over the edge - it was a big part of my life w/ my ex, and i'm feeling sick just writing this.

so, i'll stop.  just horrible.  i can't get away from him even thru innocuous comedies! 

I resonate with watching shows and being reminded of the past.  I hope that tension that brought on leaves soon.

 :hug:

i hope so, too, rainy.  thanks.   :hug:

thank you, notalone, for that hug.   :hug:

i just heard, and want to say r.i.p, tina.  what a performer, role model, and courageous woman you were.  :hug:

Hi Sanmagic7

I am so relieved for you both on your financial front.  I so understand though about  the time it will take to recuperate from the stress, reactions, feelings before receiving news of some support.

I so relate to the sensitivity to everything and going into a tailspin at the drop of a hat.  And no reserves to deal with anything and feeling like I need reassurance as well to validate my feelings.  I continue to be amazed and encouraged that many of us have the shared struggles. 

I hope you can rest your body, mind and soul knowing you both will be okay til the end of year.  And if you can't thats okay  but know that my thoughts are with you in support of you doing whatever it is your body, mind and soul need.

:hug: if okay, if helpful at all Sanmagic7

moondance, you hit so many nails on the head.  thank you so.  only today am i feeling a bit better.  and, for the record, hugs are always welcomed and appreciated. :hug:

hopefully i'll find some energy today.  sometimes it's amazing to me how much stress a certain situation holds, how much i then hold because of the situation, and how awful and long the crash afterward can be.  and it's actually gotten better over the years.  there was a time when i was in mexico that i was bedridden for 6 mos. becuz of what had come before it (part of which was my wedding).  even the joyous times can be that stressful.

like moondance mentioned, no reserves anymore.  i can't imagine doing even a sliver of my life 30 yrs. ago now.  don't know how i did it then.  but i've had to learn how to balance myself, how to tell when i'm too close to the line of a major breakdown, how to take the time i need to do nothing more than rest.  expend so much thought and energy for me.  that was tough, still is at times, cuz i didn't really exist for too long.  learning learning learning.

i missed tina turner yesterday, cried a bit.  i was fortunate enough to see her live after she was in her 50's, and she had to do part of her show sitting on a stool.  but her voice and her vibrance were still there.  it was great and an experience i'll never forget but will forever hold in my heart w/ gratitude.  so many of my rock favorites are going or gone, but i've appreciated and danced to every one of them.  and dancing is always good, to my mind.  it's a sort of freedom, which i treasure.

so much of my life has been about freedom.  moving across the country and out of my parents' house at 21 was my declaration of freedom.  even a few years before that, when i went away to college, i had my first taste of it.  it's then i began realizing how very anxious i had been living under my parents' roof.  fingernails i'd always bitten down to the quick suddenly were allowed to grow and become beautiful.  freedom to be or become who i was and was meant to be.  i'm still finding out w/ therapy, but it's a different kind of learning.  one that at times i hate but otherwise appreciate so very much.

ok, nostalgic rambling.  tina's passing brought all that out.  i really do live in the 60's - it's when i began blooming.

 :bighug:

I'm sorry you've had to deal with your therapist cancelling on you repeatedly, and also having a hard time with the disability process and finances.  It certainly sounds like you are going through quite a lot of stress and difficulties.  I'm sending you thoughts of warmth and support.   :hug:

 :bighug:

You have a new kind of freedom now, mental freedom and a fabulous mind to explore and discover who you are and to rewrite the things that were not as they should have been for fabulous you.

moondance, i loved that big hug.  thank you!  :hug:

natureluvr, thank you so much for your kindness and support.  and, yep, it's turned out to be a lot more stressful than i realized.  getting thru it w/ a lot of help from my T and the people here. :hug:

lovelovelove that big hug, armee.  i have to admit, i still don't quite feel mentally free.  still too many triggers, flashbacks, bad memories.  hopefully that will continue to ease as i keep going, but i understand what you meant.  thanks for your support, as always, and for your kind and caring words. :hug:

therapy in a few.  getting thru these days w/ finances still hanging over our heads has been difficult.  i think i'm doing ok, then a thought pops into my head or my D mentions something and off i go again.  someone mentioned not having reserves, and i feel that precisely.  my D's source of help hasn't been quite nailed down yet, so i'm still on tenterhooks inside.  hopefully she'll get a definite 'yes' today and the payment schedule can be set up. 

i can't believe this is happening.

i became so sick-feeling 2 days ago from holding all the stress of this financial business that i could barely move myself around the house.  felt awful, miserable.  finally, the other night my D told me that her client/friend was going to come thru and we'd be ok and i burst into sobs, sobbed for about 10 min.  afterwards, i could physically feel the release of all that stress and i began feeling better.  yesterday i returned to regular, was able to go delivering w/ my D as if nothing had happened.  amazing.

someone mentioned about the body keeping the score.  this was clear proof to me it does indeed.  day and night in a matter of a few minutes.  so, now, onward.

Sending love and good thoughts, san :bighug:

finally, the other night my D told me that her client/friend was going to come thru and we'd be ok and i burst into sobs, sobbed for about 10 min.  afterwards, i could physically feel the release of all that stress and i began feeling better.  yesterday i returned to regular, was able to go delivering w/ my D as if nothing had happened.  amazing.

I'm so glad to hear that you had such relief from the stress!  BTW, crying for me almost always gives me a deep sense of relief and unburdening myself. 

I'm assuming your D is your daughter? 

 :bighug:

bach, i'll take both gladly!  thank you so.  :hug:

hey, natureluvr, yes, D is for daughter.  i live w/ her.  she is one of the reasons i'm able to make any progress at all w/ healing. crying often brings relief to me, too, or at least releases toxins that have built up over a long-ago trauma.  i have a hard time reaching that point, however, so i was glad to be able to do it that evening.  thank you for the support. :hug:

armee, thanks so much for that big hug.  i can feel its warmth and caring.  :hug:

i'm stuck.  something new is going on in my life, but i don't know how to explain it.  it's about an old flame.  i'm afraid it will be messy, but i needed to get him access to me so he'd leave my D alone.  i'll deal w/ it, whatever happens.  it just felt like the right thing to do, but my D and i got into a fight about it.  i can hear me and the red flags that have already gone up.  the past 3 days, however, this has been a great distraction from all the trauma stuff that usually invades my privacy.  we'll see.

Oh, San. I'm sorry. That sounds difficult and confusing. Stay safe.

thanks, armee.  it has been stressful, but i accomplished my major aim, which was to get him to stop contacting my D.  i believed if he had access to me, he'd leave her alone.  i'll deal w/ the fallout from it, whatever it might be.  he and i have a complicated history since the 60's.  it'll work out for the best in the end, tho.  i'm quite sure about that. :hug:

did some work last week on the sex addiction issue w/ my ex.  very difficult, lots of sets, but i think it's made an impact.  last nite we watched some outtakes from Big Bang Theory and one of them was about the scene that sent me out of the room the week before.  i just panicked, closed my eyes, stated yelling 'no, no, no' to my D, and made gibberish noises so i couldn't hear anything. 

it was a reflex reaction, but all the while i was thinking 'i could deal with this now'.  in someone else's journal there was a bit of a discussion about how we can sometimes think 'i've got this now' or 'i don't think i need therapy anymore'.  i believe my reaction and my thoughts were so far away from each other, it gives me pause as i write about it now.  how those 2 polar opposites made themselves known at the very same time, one making a lie out of the other.

at times, this stuff is fascinating even while it's awful.

It is fascinating San and I've experienced extreme examples of the same phenomenon.

But maybe you were right that you could deal with this now, and maybe covering your ears and making gibberish sounds is not so contradictory to that thought. Maybe that is a way to deal with it...block it out so you can continue on with D and the show?

I'm so sorry you are in a position of having to let someone back into your life so he will leave D alone. But I trust you that you've got this.  :hug:

I can't imagine the layers and level of trauma embedded in what your ex put you through with his sex addiction.  :hug: hugs to you as you go through processing the pieces.   

thanks, armee.  i so appreciate your insight and support. :hug:

like i told my T, the stress of this situation is better than the trauma stress i experience.  i even found myself, when thoughts of my ex came up, saying the other guy's name over and over, and it blew the trauma crapola away.  so, it was nice to have that work for me.  right now he's taking a break from me - his wife died a month ago, and we have a complicated history, to say the least.  but i told him some of my trauma stuff, and i have no idea how that landed w/ him.  we'll see.

just doing day by day right now.  i have a sleep study interview coming up on the 12th.  should be interesting.  i've done one of the overnight studies about 30 yrs. ago, and they came up w/ restless legs syndrome (rls).  sleep apnea wasn't on anyone's radar back then, i don't think, or i didn't display any signs of it at the time.  so, i've been on meds for sleep since then.  we'll see what happens this time, if they'll even bring me in.

shrink tomorrow.  she's decent, gives me my meds w/o hassle. 

really no problems w/ either of these, don't have to go anywhere, but i can feel the anxiety building up.  i hate this crapola.

i learned 2 major things this morning w/ my T that hadn't really hit me the same way before.  i was processing some of the sex stuff about my ex and my D's, when i came up with the idea that i wished i could've done more to get to the reality of what D1 told me about a certain situation.  i did my best to protect my D's after i'd heard, but felt helpless that i couldn't do more.  i said i did the best i could in the situation.

my T pointed out to me that such a statement was one of compassion for myself.  huh.  compassion, i would never have guessed that.  she also told me i did the best i could in an impossible situation.  that struck a bell w/ me as well.  the idea of doing anything positive in an impossible situation, that it truly was an impossible situation.  as in not possible to fix, alter, make any better than i had.  impossible.

and i said, yeah, how can anyone actually do anything if a situation is impossible?!  there's such a finality to that thought which i'd never gotten to before.  we did quite a bit of processing, and i'm still wondering where it will all stick. she asked me what i'd thought when my D1 told me about it happening, how i felt, i told her i basically thought 'o my god, this isn't over yet!  it keeps happening!' and i remember feeling weary to the bone w/ all this crapola. 

and i remembered back to another occasion, after spending years w/ D1, her maladies, her SI, her abuse, my darling D called me into her room one afternoon, a bottle of pills in her hand, telling me she'd just taken a bunch.  i remember having the same exact thought, that here we go again, and it was up to me to take care of the situation.  weary of it all, yet somehow finding what i needed to do exactly that.

i'm still weary.  all this financial stress, all the disability stuff, going out delivering w/ my D is wearing me down once again.  i'm carrying too much, yet i have to anyway.  weary.  my word of the day, of much of my life.  some relief would be nice.

 :grouphug:

I have so much compassion for you in that hug and so many words to say but typing right now is too hard but I hope you feel me with you here.

i do feel you with me, armee.  thank you so much for your compassion on my behalf.  it helped and felt really good. :hug:

i have a zoom appt. for sleep disorder in a few hours, and i can feel the anxiety ramping up.  some of the anxiety stems from doing a zoom call, which i know nothing about.  my D is going to set it up on her computer, but i've got all the worries about it it decides to freeze, go wonky, something goes wrong and i don't know how to fix it.  she won't be home at the time, which is why my anxiety is so high about this.

i swear, when it comes to technology, i AM a dinosaur.  we had to call a place yesterday about some financial stuff, and i can't even imagine going thru the process my D went thru w/ them.  i needed meds afterwards, took the rest of the day off in front of the tv, and i hadn't said a word.  i just watched her navigate all the website stuff and got drained by it.

as far as the situation w/ that guy goes, i'll call him X, i discovered i had a lot of stress about whether he was going to decide he didn't want to do this anymore.  he's a long, lost love, and i made the wrong decision about who to be w/ 60 yrs. ago.  yep, the one that got away.  so now he's grieving his wife of 50 yrs., and seemingly has latched onto me.  very sweet, sends me music to listen to, asks me questions, answers mine.  i don't know what this is, where it's going, but i've been able to use his name several times now to ward off bad memories, and i'm grateful for that. 

Best wishes with the Zoom appointment.

I'm sending encouraging thoughts your way Sanmagic7 regarding the zoom meeting in particular.  You can do this. 

When I read about X having a positive influence with your bad memories I felt joy for you.  How sweet is that that 1. That his name wards off bad memories and 2. This even reached as far as little old me and had a positive effect on me.

Caring :hug: sent your way

 :hug:

I hope the technology worked for you. It's hard to use until you're used to how to operate it and find things like the camera and audio. But doctors offices are used to working with people who haven't used it before so I guarantee there was no judgement if you struggled to get it to work.  :grouphug:

But yikes yes the stress!!!

X sounds like a potentially tricky situation, but also one where maybe there's something being offered that might help with healing, regardless of what happens long term. I hope you get some joy from this.  :grouphug: 

thanks, rainy.  more later. :hug:

i appreciated the encouragement, moondance.  and, yeah, sometimes it's weird how something/someone unrelated to our lives can impact them anyway. thanks for your thoughts. :hug:

armee, my D set it all up for me, so it worked fine. thank you for your concern about my 'tricky' situation. my D can't stand him cuz of her own experience w/ him, but his presence has been helping me stave off the trauma flashbacks.  when she was setting me up for zoom, we had to go thru my email, and his name was on there a lot.  i knew she'd see it, and she did, and she 'whooshed' out a giant breath when she saw all his emails.  i talked to my T about it, came to the conclusion that she's still got her relationship w/ her father who she knows was awful to me, but he helps her.  i'm seeing my situation the same way.   :hug:

the zoom appt. was so stressful to me that i depersonalized throughout the entire thing.  the guy was ok, clinical but impersonal, but my personality left me.  my voice had no inflection, it was nearly an octave lower than normal, and it was also very small and quiet.  i had no emotions, could barely speak even when i realized this wasn't me, i couldn't change it. 

afterwards, i thought that's what happened the first time i went to see the derm doc.  small voice, no inflection, could barely speak, no eye contact.  this has happened before w/ an interview for an internship.  it was like my true self stayed out in the hallway when i went thru the door.  i didn't get the internship. 

i checked out depersonalization and what i read said it can happen when a person feels under an immense threat.  i guess that's where i've gotten to now - feeling so threatened by the medical profession my 'self' runs away, leaving a shell to deal w/ the situation.  funny, tho, when i went back to the derm doc and was given proper topical pain - can't think of the word - i was able to speak up and be myself.  this stuff is frickin' weird.

i just realized that i'm a bit stymied w/ this new platform?  is that what this is?  i lost my picture, don't know how to get that back (someone helped me last time), don't see any 'updated topics' that i used to rely on, and don't see 'messages'. any help?  or does this need to go to kizzie.  this stuff just swirls my brain and a feel all whack-a-doodle.

Yeah it's rough. The changed format.

I haven't tried to look for the pictures yet. But for updated topics for me on my phone I see  ABOVE the Out of the Storm banner a little black bell with a number in a circle that's where me unread messages show up. It took me awhile to find it.

I really agree how this stuff is so weird.  I, for example can be more me with my T than anyone else.  And the other day when I was at the doctor's office I was so not myself.  The first time I met my doc I was more myself but as she dismisses me, is rude to me, disrespect me I get weirder with her everytime or in her presence I get weirder.   And I actually tell myself before I see her to breath, speak up, but I don't.  Well unless sometimes I get so frustrated, tongue tied, almost stammering to get the words out. 

So I can so relate to this San.  It does not feel good to not have control over this.

 :bighug:

Hi SanMagic,
The changed format is also taking some time for me to try to get used to - I think it is discombobulating.  But hopefully over time we'll be able to negotiate it and get used to it.  I hope so.  I was grateful to you for mentioning how you felt about it, as it helped me to feel better about my own thoughts regarding it. 

Sending you a hug  :hug:

Hope  :)

hey, armee, thanks a lot.  i tried that little black bell, i got a statement about alerts, which is vacant.  the other black symbol was about messages, so at least there's that.  just the appearance of this is still odd to me. i'm also trying a different font - i've never enjoyed courier.  let's see where that goes.  :hug:

thanks, moondance, altho i'm sorry you experience that depersonalization thing, too.  it's so disconcerting, so distressing. too many in the medical profession . . . ugh !loved that big hug!   :hug:

hi hope, discombobulating is a good word for it.  thanks for that validation.  :hug:

i got thru it w/ X yesterday.  i had a meltdown while i was writing (we're still just doing emails - feels too soon and too personal to talk, at least for me) and some of the trauma w/ my ex came out and i sent it.  i sent another email soon after telling him i was pretty broken, i'd understand if he didn't want to deal w/ me, the whole 9 yards.  when he finally replied, to told me not to worry, everyone has ghosts, say what i want, and then he told me a very personal thing.

he said he hadn't meant to tell me, but he sent it to me anyway.  i burst into tears, part relief, and part from the idea that he was accepting me just as i am. he's been kind to me, something as many of us know hasn't had a lot of room in our lives.  all in all, i feel calmer, slept well.  so far so good.


as far as medical stuff goes, i'm avoiding it all for now.  i need to call medicare to see if they cover any of this sleep study stuff, but that's not gonna happen this week.  still too weirded out by my experience on zoom.  it's like i don't want to touch anything that has to do w/ that, as if it's akin to putting my finger into an electrical socket.  terrible imagery to carry around about it, i know.  but, there it is. it's just there.

 :hug:

thanks, armee, for that hug.  it felt warm and caring. :hug:

well, i've hit a snag w/ X.  this feels like new territory for me, trying to build a relationship w/ boundaries and emotions, what to be accepting of, where to draw a line.  my D has had issues w/ him in the past, and i put it out there from the beginning he's not to contact her at all anymore.  he agreed.  in another email, not too long after, he asked about her and i told him she's ok not being part of what's going on between him and me.

since then there have been several more inquiries from him about her. one time i told him i had demons i wanted to get rid of, he asked if my D had the same demons. i didn't answer that at all.  once he asked how she was dealing w/ him and i communicating, and  i made a big mistake, told him she doesn't like it, but she tolerates it.  he then, in subsequent emails, made several references to her, at one point telling me to tell her to contact him if i was having problems w/ him that i couldn't see, and to tell her he wasn't planning to visit and we were only communicating via email.

i ended up boiling over and tore him a new one, talked about how disrespectful he was, asking what his 'thing' was w/ my D, told him he's got 2 D's of his own to worry about, they've all been thru a crisis (his wife died last month) and could be a support for each other, or to go get grief counseling, whatever, just to leave my D alone.  it was a revelation to me that it only took 2 weeks before i was able to feel angry about this.

i don't know if he's just dense or if i hadn't made myself clear.  his reply was that he had no idea about what i was talking about, he had no interest in my D, and he was just trying to make sure our little family unit was remaining intact, that he wasn't causing trouble.

i don't know if it's worth trying to explain to him what i meant - we had a similar problem the last time we were in touch w/ each other - i don't know if i'm in the wrong, i don't know if i should just leave this alone.  stressful.  every time he'd mention my D's name, i could feel a twinge inside, surrounding a pin of frustration.  i'm not sure what's acceptable in relationships anymore, how much to allow, when to stop them.  ugh!

never mind.  it's done.  i wrote him, told him i couldn't do this, it was too stressful for me.  i'm glad i did it.  i felt like the proverbial cat on a hot tin roof nearly the entire time - 2 1/2 weeks.  but i accomplished my goad of getting him out of my D's life.  it took its toll, and he's in a bad way emotionally, but i've decided i can't be the distraction he needs.  besides, what he really needs is grief counseling, and i told him so, but i don't think that's something he'll explore.  so, out of my hands now.  he may write back, but i don't really care now.  he was a good distraction from trauma stress for a bit, but the stress of protecting my D and figuring out how to be in a relationship of any kind w/ him took too big a toll.  deep breath. :spaceship:  and i'm out.

San, I am grateful you listened to yourself and are stepping away from a relationship that isn't right.

thanks for that, rainy.  it's just what i needed to hear. :hug:

san :bighug:

San, I'm really glad that you listened to yourself about the relationship.

I'm also having a hard time adjusting to the new format. I think that I was the last one to get back on, so I am glad to be here.

I couldn't say it any better than Rainy.  :grouphug:

bach, thanks for that big hug.  it felt just right. :hug:

thank you notalone.  i'm glad i listened, too. and i'm glad you made it back! :hug:

thanks for all the hugs, armee, and for the sentiment. :hug:

the stress is slowly sliming off my body, it feels like.  i didn't have a rush of 'whew! it's done!' and feel like a great weight lifted off me.  it was more of a knowing i wouldn't have to go thru more stress.  he was part of a fantasy world i'd wandered in for 60 yrs.  the circumstances surrounding him reaching out to me were too horrible to see if i could rekindle old feelings, and i was confused about how to feel, what to do or say, how to be with it all.   :sharkbait: yep, just trying to stay one step away from catastrophe.

if nothing else, this gave me a clearer picture of how broken i am re: having relationships.  there were things that were bothering me, and i let them go cuz i didn't realize how they were bothering me, and then i blew up, which blew him out of the water.  i can't imagine having a relationship like that in real life.  the one w/ my D is all about gentle acceptance and we've worked hard over the years to get to this point.  i have a hard time picturing that w/ someone else.

at any rate, i don't know if he'll write back, but i just feel more 'solid', that's the word, and i don't doubt i'll stop feeling so tired throughout the day.  thanks for all your reassurance and validation.  it was really good to see. :grouphug:

San, today I journaled on the question what are my strengths in relationships and I found that question so difficult.  I am grateful you are feeling solid within yourself.

thanks, rainy.  i'm learning. it certainly hasn't always been a solid feeling.  you'll get there.  actually, altho i'm glad i did what i did, i still have those nagging questions - should i have given it more time? can i trust myself that i did the right thing?  did i hurt another person w/ my decision? am i being too sensitive? there's still a lot going on inside me, but i'm willing myself not to go back, not to apologize, not to open this up again.  sometimes learning isn't a straight line, either.  :hug:   

I think you did a fantastic job of listening to and following your gut on this one.  :grouphug:

thanks, armee.  it's a battle every day not to write him.  i just have to remember how stressful it was, how confusing at times, how much i just didn't understand, and how complicated it felt.  i guess those are enough reasons to not go back, right?  dang, i hate this uncertainty. :hug:

I hate the uncertainty as well Sanmagic7.

Although a difficult decision Sanmagic7 I think you did really well in looking after yourself and your peace of mind. 

 :bighug:

San, I resonate with feeling uncertain within myself for decisions that I know are right but might look differently at different moments depending on context.  I hope that you find some ease moving forward and give yourself lots of care through uncertainty.

 :hug:

It sounds like a really confusing situation.

thank you, moondance.  i so appreciate the support and your words of encouragement :hug:

rainy, your words, i felt the caring in them.  thank you. it's true - i know it's right but the battle rages on.  your words helped make me stronger. :hug:

armee, 'confusing' hit me in the gut.  that's just what this has been from day 1.  a relationship should not be confusing day after day.  thank you.  :hug:

i've lived in a fantasy world about this man for half a century.  part of my confusion was trying to cement the fact that we aren't what we were, he wasn't going to take me away on his white horse and take care of me for the rest of my life, and those red flags are real.  that last one is the hardest to cement w/in my mind.  this was a whole ****show of emotions, hopes, dreams, from nearly 60 yrs. ago.

i'll talk to my t about this again tomorrow.  my head is still so full of this, it's difficult to ease off it.  one thing i do know is that i'm not as stressed, which is a good thing.  still somewhat but not as much.  dang, men in my life.  they've been what i thought were life rafts for me.  i've depended on men to define me cuz i had no self-definition.  i guess i have some daddy issues to get into and resolved.

yep, daddy issues.  he raised me to be a tough street kid of the male variety. my name is a derivative of my grandfather's name, the nickname my dad called me by was from a cartoon character who happened to be a little boy of the street kid variety, and many more memories of my girlhood being denied - no, you don't want to be a princess, etc. i wanted to do girl things when i was in junior high and was not allowed (shaving my legs - 'if you start you'll never be able to stop, so, no'), my first bra came via one of my aunts rather than my mother, wearing makeup was prohibited until i was a senior. 

so, the X thing followed a long line of wanting to be defined as a girl by men.  it's been an endless vortex, couldn't get enough of them, each one giving me touch, a sense of desirability, and affirmation that i was a girl.  somewhat like an addiction - the hole could not be filled.  it makes me want to cry just thinking about it.

we did some flash technique on the princess part.  i had mentioned to her that i'd covered this in my NN, but for some reason it didn't stick.  She thought it might be because i was imagining my father doing something different and he really didn't have the capability to do what i needed, something like that.  instead, she had me imagine adult me was in that picture w/ 4-yr. old me who wanted to be a princess, and sure enough, the tears fell like waterfalls down my face.  i saw myself open my arms to her and she ran into them.  i'd never felt so cared for before.

it was rough, tho.  my T also asked me what my parents called me, what name they called me, and i remembered my dad would call me by my nickname unless he was upset about something.  that's when he'd call me by my real name.  i don't remember my mother calling me by a name.  my T asked what i called my 4-yr. old self in my image, and i said, 'probably darlin' or sweetheart'.  she was satisfied w/ that.

there's a lot more work to be done, but it's a start.  there's one silver lining from the X thing - i got to recognize my dependence on men for the defining of myself as a girl/woman.  so strange how this can happen, but as i look back, i kept trying to get all the things from random men i'd needed from my F and didn't get.

on another topic, i want to put an avatar up, but don't know how to do it.  would someone help me w/ this?  thanks. 

Avatar instructions here:
https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=11501.0

It sounds like you made good progress in your last therapy session, even though it was rough.  :grouphug:

San, I appreciate your reflections on the experience of gender expectations and expression. 

 :wave:

If you need additional support or step by step support to upload Avatar feel free to message me San.

 :hug:

sanmagic, I'm glad that your decision to break it off with X has helped you be a lot less stressed.  It sounds like you did the right thing for you. I don't think a healthy relationships is supposed to be so complicated and confusing. 

thanks for the link, NK.  i worked on it quite a bit, several different ways, right now i have to take a rest from it.  too much info for this old brain to process and make sense of.  but, i'll try again.  i really appreciate this. and, yes, the progress was good, altho it's taking me a bit of time to process it all.  another addiction?  dang, thought i had those all figured out!  :hug:

rainy, thanks for your support, as always.  it's been feeling to me like i've had to fight against my being, my girl essence, all my life.  no wonder i'm so tired - so many battles, and this is another one brought to light. :hug:

moondance, i really appreciate your offer.  i'm going to give it one more shot, just not now, gotta rest from grappling w/ it, but if it doesn't work, i'll certainly give you a holler.  thanks :hug:

NL, i think you hit an important point right on the head. i don't think a healthy relationship should be so complicated and confusing, either.  thank you for that insight and your support.  :hug:

everyone here has helped me w/ a lot of clarity about the X thing, and i'm so grateful.  also talked to my T and girlfriend about it, they're in agreement - let this guy go.  i've had such a rich fantasy life about some man taking care of me like my dad never did, and i'm realizing how that has followed me most of my life.  plus, using men as the means to defining me as a girl rather than a boy - that's knocked my socks off. 

at least now i know the reality, still processing all it means.  i've lived in this fantasy since high school - many moons ago. being w/o definition, not only as female but also as a person (my T agreed w/ me some of this might have to do w/ being on the edge of the spectrum) has been a double whammy.  dang, this crapola is tough to wrap my head around.  gotta stop here - i'm getting dizzy.

 :grouphug:

It's difficult to feel like you don't have an outline, to not see and feel definition, to have had even your basic biology and identity denied. You were seeking validation of who you are. That's natural to do. But gosh am I sorry that you were denied that validation by people who most owed it to you, and that in seeking that validation you were hurt badly. That sucks. But it wasn't your fault :hug:

You are one strong and feminine wonder woman and I am so happy to know you.

San, what you wrote about your dad and princess was very profound. It felt like there should have been lightening bolts around your words, because it is so significant. If I had your address, you would be receiving a whole lot of frilly and sparkly pink and purple things from me.  :grouphug:

armee, all you said was on the money.  thank you so for your support. :hug:

notalone, your comments made me feel soft and squishy in a good way.  thank you for that thought. :hug:

therapy was interesting yesterday.  i actually got into some things about my M and my reaction was unexpected, to say the least.





TW******* pinworms and doctor care *********







i don't know exactly what led up to it, but i had a memory about when i got pinworms from sitting on the floor in kindergarten (they were like head lice back then, very common, but showed up in little girl 'parts').  this was back in the day when docs made house calls, and he came that night after i was itching and scratching so badly and it wouldn't stop.

so, i was 4 or 5, laid on the bed, and this strange man had his fingers all over 'down there' and i lay still, in the dark, only his flashlight, not moving, not saying anything, not crying, nothing, like i was a corpse.  i knew this was expected of me, but as i remembered it yesterday, i felt violated.  my M was in the room somewhere, but nowhere near me, no comforting words or caresses, nothing reassuring.  i lay there on my own. 



End TW ****************

i realized that all this time, all my life, w/o knowing, i've felt like i've not been worthy of caring about or for, not worth comfort, not worth kindness or gentleness.  not worthy.  i didn't know this, but looking back, all my relationships scream this to me now.  including w/ my D1 and my first therapist, icky L. 

so we decided to flash thru this and the strangest thing happened - it was like my entire body seized up, ramrod straight, then it jack knifed and my eyelids were flapping out of control.  this happened twice, one after the other and i yelled at my t (she was on the phone so didn't see me) to stop.

afterwards, we talked about such a visceral reaction to the idea of believing my unworthiness, and i said that i believe this was not just something in my mind, but at a cellular level.  like deep in my cells, this belief has lived nearly all my life.  this is more than brain activity, neural processing, etc. rather than a belief, it feels like a 'knowing'.  i asked my T if she thought this could be true, and she said she did.  she said she's read research about people in the present reporting on things like the irish potato famine, generational trauma written into their dna.

the experience rocked me, to say the least.  i feel a bit numb right now, like it's too big to let sink into my thought processes.  yesterday, however, for the first time that i can remember, the thought of SH came to me.  that was scary, but it also let me know just how big this is for me, how much this has affected every part of every relationship.  it explains why i stayed too long, why i never knew any boundaries, why i allowed abuse, manipulation, humiliation, all that good stuff over and over and over, from one person to the next. 

it's why i put up w/ too much nearly all the time, and why, when i'd visit my D and she was always kind and patient w/ me, i'd burst into tears at the end of my visit, thanking her, feeling so much gratitude for treating me so wonderfully.  when we've talked about it later, she told me she didn't understand why i reacted like that when all she was doing was showing basic human kindness.  it never felt basic to me.

it also explains why i'll cry at any show of love and sweetness to another, or even when speaking on the topic (this happened a lot in support groups). 

and, i just remembered about this 'being a girl' thing.  i was at a woman's retreat, and one of my biggest issues was having been treated like a boy.  we did a whole rebirthing thing for it, but apparently that didn't stick, either.  at the time, i know when the ritual was finished, i didn't have any sort of revelation, didn't feel any different.  this was about 30 yrs. ago. it's been within me forever.

i'm tired now.  time to relax.

I can so relate to your feelings expressed in your post.

Thank you for sharing this experience Sanmagic7 and being able to write about it, although difficult is so helpful to me.

At the core of me I also feel undeserving of love and care.  It is the thing I crave the most for but am unable to acceot, unable to take it in.  I do not wish that on anyone else.

I'm so very sorry Sanmagic7 that as a child you did not receive the support, the care, the love, the interest you so deserved.  You deserve this and so much more.  I  say that to you wholeheartedly.

 :bighug:

I've just finished reading "Mother Hunger" by Kelly McDaniel. It has been an informative, if triggering and emotional read. Very valuable but to be treated with some care. I mention it, sanmagic7, because there is quite a bit in there about epigenetic trauma. Your experience of "knowing" speaks to that very much.

thank you, moondance, for your care and support.  i've gotten more of that here, from strangers, and it sometimes amazes me.  mostly because i know my parents were abused, they did their best, but they were not emotionally present at all.  it helps explain my lack of emotions/feelings, which i'm just beginning to understand and know in the past few years.  i hope you get to the place of being able to accept support and care for what it is. you deserve it, too. :hug:

NK, i looked up epigenetic trauma, and yeah, i can totally relate.  thank you for that.  the 'knowing' instead of believing or feeling or some kind of awareness is very different.  i'm still processing. :hug:

like i said, still processing this.  i can tell i'm staying away from it, giving it some distance in my mind, can't go too near it yet.  instead, i've been eating like crazy, craving sugar, wanting to give my brain something else to concentrate on.  i'm feeling wary of approaching the topic cuz i feel like i'm in the midst of an existential crisis.  i'm teetering on a tightrope of sanity, very purposefully putting one foot in front of the other to get thru the day.

the 'seizure' experience will have to be explored tomorrow w/ my T.  i think if she would have seen it she would've been horrified.  it may help explain why so many of my unfelt emotions/feelings result in psychosomatic manifestations.  my brain can't always manage all this 'newness' of feeling emotions i never felt before, and this experience sent it over the top, it seems.  anyway, more resting, more just get thru today, get to tomorrow, it's all i have to do.

 :bighug:

love that big hug, moondance.  thanks so much. :hug:

one thought that went thru my mind the other day was i don't know how people have been able to live believing they're not worthy of care and love.  it was similar to the thought i had a couple years ago when i consciously felt fear for the first time.  it felt so awful to me that i didn't understand how people have lived their lives feeling such a terrible (to me) emotion.

i guess it was part of my survival mechanism at work - to not feel, to not know, to not realize or recognize.  it's weird to think that finally, in old age, i'm beginning to understand who i am, know who i am, and define myself.  too weird to think on this for more than a few seconds.

Yes definitely a survival mechanism kicked in for me as well Sanmagic7.

When I look back at my work life I see that my work was my life. I got lost in each job.  I think I believed at my core that I could lean on a job for support.  Gosh that is sad.    What I accomplished in my work gave me some value.  And it seems now that I have actual time to think things thru (as much as i can tolerate) each job I have had has been abusive to me in some form. 

Since I, as a person did not ever feel valued  I "produced" to feel or get value.  I think that kept me going for a long while. 

I'm no longer able to "produce" much of anything - therefore have no value as I knew it.  To go forward that has to change but that seems insurmountable at the moment.  As you nentioned Sannagic7 one step in front of the other is what I can muster. Gosh I'm a poet and I didn't even know it.   ;D

I'm able to value each of you and know your worth but have great difficulty knowing or believing in my own worth. 

Here is to learning, getting to know ourselves and defining ourselves and hopefully valuing ourselves.


 

 :bighug:  :bighug:

San, I resonate with not feeling and not thinking on that stuff.  I appreciate your example because it reminds me that we are constantly learning no matter our age.

moondance, thanks so much for your continuing support.  it certainly is rough to be an unformed/undefined shell of a person.  i also get the having to 'produce' to be of value.  sucks that we weren't shown how to be whole from the beginning.   :hug:

armee, 2 big hugs!  thank you my dear.  :hug:

rainy, i agree we can continue to learn no matter what our age.  unfortunately, i know too many people who stopped cuz they thought they knew everything they needed.  they've often turned out to be judgmental and unaccepting.  too bad.  not here, tho. :hug:

i've been pondering the difference between deserving of and being worthy of.  i remember my D once telling me i didn't think i deserved nice things.  i told her that wasn't true - one of my dreams has been to spend a few nights in a 5-star hotel.  that feels pretty swanky and decadent to me, but i'd love the experience.  but this idea of being unworthy of kindness, attention, caring, gentleness, affection, etc. is a whole different ball game.

i've had plenty of compliments, accolades, accomplishments, 'i love you's', etc. in my life and i never once4 thought i didn't deserve them.  i know i've worked my tail off to make those things happen.  after the humiliating way i was treated by my folks when i was 14 when i came to them in a meltdown about feeling so very lonely, i set about constructing a new me so i would never feel lonely again.

it took a few years, mistrials, errors, but by the time i was a senior i was popular, had a ton of friends, my boyfriend was a BBall player, plus i did really well in school.  i lived as that construct most of my life since then.  she knew what to say, how to compliment people so they'd feel good and want to be around her, and kept learning about how to keep people liking her.  she never wanted to feel lonely again.

so, yeah, i never had a problem accepting gifts, compliments, etc. cuz i felt i deserved them for being the person i was.  this new revelation, however, about not feeling worthy, is a different feeling.  the construct girl was all surface shiny.  the unworthy girl was gray and neutral. to think now that i've lived my entire life unable to feel worthy of the real, human things, has nearly blown my mind, and not in a good way.

my T asked me if i still feel unworthy.  i told her i was the one who, in a presentation or seminar setting, could write 20 good things about myself w/o thinking about it.  i knew all those parts of me.  but, buying something new for myself isn't in my wheelhouse.  i've grown up learning how to make do, when it comes to material things.  i also learned how to make do when someone treated me badly. i never learned i was worth anything under the surface.

it's a strange feeling. 

 :bighug:

thank you, moondance, for that big hug.  it felt good. :hug:

still thinking about all this.  i remember being a little girl, all cute and quirky.  i think i may have modeled my construct on her.  by the time i was 14, she was all but gone.  but i still feel her spirit - that's one thing that's never left me and i'm so glad about that.

this is hard, and i feel like i'm rambling just to get words down and try to make sense of all this.

I really get that as well San.  It seems to permeate through everything, skewing my views and how I see things and perhaps even others.  I'm hoping my replies are not causing any issues for you.  If yes please do let me know.

It is kinda mind boggling to me how I went thru life feeling this way about myself.

 :hug: 

no problems, moondance.  it is mind boggling, and mine is still dancing around it. :hug:

Same here San.

I hope you get a reprieve from it no matter how small of one.

 :bighug:

thanks, moondance f9r thatbig hug and support :hug:

i'm dealing w/ a physical issue today, doc's office isn't open till tomorro? maybe? it's an eye thing, i've had it attended to 2x before, it's looking like it's going to be an every 6-mo. ordeal.  several years ago i scraped the inside of my eyelid q/ a fingernail, and apparently the cells there don't heal correctly, and cause irritation.  i'm in a lot of pain, am doing eyedrops seve3eral times/day. 

well, it's distracted me from this other stuff.  my D just got an investor, and i found myself thinking that if this is the price for that, i'm willing to pay it. 

until whenever - i need a break from thinking

 :wave:  :bighug:

I recall how very painful the eye thing gets. Sending virtual balm to numb the pain.  :grouphug:

thank you all for your support and kindness.  i've tried answering a few journals, but i can't look at the screen, even w/ sunglasses on.  my appt. is a week from today.  i forgot how awful this is. 

 :hug:

Your appointment is too far away.  :hug:

I am hoping for easing of your eye pain.

 :hug:

armee, rainy, EA, thank you for your hugs and well wishes. i've been doubling my advil and meds to try to keep the inflammation down, which has been helping, but it's not done.  my best wishes to you all.   :hug:  :hug:  :hug:

I hope that you have healing and relief for your eye soon.

thanks, notalone. it's a bit better today. :hug:

i'm having a hard time hanging on right now.  my D has been going thru a lot of medical problems, mostly due to her anxiety, and i've been listening to doc reports, blood results, urine tests, probabilities, possibilities, had to file a complaint about the doc she saw who was absolutely awful, telling her basically she had to get her anxiety under control and there are different measures, such as electro-shock therapy that can help.

this isn't even his field. he was also cold, curt, impersonal, denied her a urine test she wanted, harped at her.  at one point i said - do you know what you've just done to her anxiety by saying those things?  his reply - i'm just here to give information.  this was 3 days ago, she's still a wreck from him making her feel like her problems are her fault. i filed the complaint the next day, and the supervisor was taken aback, gasped at the est reference, called what he said and did unacceptable, and assured me she would follow thru w/ the complaint.

all this brought me to a point of wanting to SH, something i'd never thought of before, just to take my mind off all of it. i didn't do anything, but my thoughts then turned to X, reaching out to him for a distraction.  i told my t yesterday i don't think i've ever been so low feeling.  she just said 'too much', and i asked her how many times she's said that to me.  too many times ' about my childhood, each of my marriages, my friendships, icky L, everything i've gone thru w/ D1, and now all this along w/ finances still being unsteady.

it is all too much and i don't know how i can stand being here much longer.  as long as my D is around, i'm safe, but i don't feel a lot of enthusiasm for self-care, my eating is completely out of control, no energy, and this frickin' eye causing my bolts of pain at times, or just over all discomfort.  i'm taking twice as many meds as normal, twice as many advil, just to keep my a bit less stressed (my t asked if the eye thing might be caused by stress), and keep the inflammation down.

i feel like rying, curlin up in a ball, and fading away, but i can't, i'm trapped here, having to find more energy than i have, not wanting any more doc conversations.  she's struggling to eat anything and my heart is breaking to see her suffer like this.  please, someone take care of her.

Oh my God that doctor. I'm sorry you had to summon the strength to file a complaint but so glad for the greater good that you did. Awful.

Hey...pain makes everything much more unbearable. Get through the pain the way you need to with medication and laying low and curling up in a ball. I wish I was there to cook for you both this week.

Your daughter's current very very low mood will shift. We can only stay super low for so long. Eventually life beckons us back to being human again. Embrace the low energy for both of you and hibernate with gusto.  :grouphug: It's what you both seem to need. Embrace it? Life sucks, let's curl up in a ball refuse to eat for the day unless we want to, or eat everything, and watch Tina Turner videos.

When I've had urges its because of the explode-y too much feeling. Maybe writing down each feeling even UUUUGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!! and scribbling with crayons or a pen will help. That feeling of too much especially without a connection to a specific thing, that becomes very unbearable and overwhelming.

I am sorry for the experiences with that physician and hope that both you and your daughter find supports in whatever form they may take. 

hey, armee, you're right about 'too much', especially w/o a concrete connection, or w/ a mixture of the two.  thanks for the suggestion about the urges.  especially the 'ugggh'!  since i can't always know/understand what i'm feeling.  i appreciate you and your support so much.  :hug:

thanks, rainy, for the support. much appreciated. :hug:

i was thinking about the title of my journal, and i think i named it 'no returns' cuz at the time i was filled w/ a determination not to return to the traumas, to turn my back on them.  unfortunately, that's not working.  they're still there, popping their heads up no matter what, and adding new traumas on top of them.  i wish my journal title would be true, but it's very far away from my truth. i may have to begin a new one.  this simply feels like a lie.

When is/was your eye doctor appt?  How are you feeling regarding the eye pain?  I agree with Armee, pain makes everything unbearable.  Even though I don't fully "subscribe" to Spoon Theory, using the term spoon as a relative unit of measure to just say "I don't have the spoon for that" has made me able to say no to things without attaching any sort of feeling to it.  Having things be "too much" and just wanting to take a break from it all is completely valid.  It IS too much, and it's not fair and you need to do whatever it is that feels like what you need. Don't beat yourself up for your eating, or wanting a distraction - there is a LOT to cope with right now. Yes, it's incredibly difficult when life is knocking on that door saying, Hey remember me? responsibility? And you just want to pull your covers over your head until the knocking stops...but maybe find it in small ways. Do whatever you can to just get through this patch. Last night, I found a 10 minute meditation that said just what I needed to hear in that moment - which is rare, but hey, a small win. We are all here, holding space for you.   :hug:

thank you, EA, for your kindness and support.  i did see the doc today, i'll write more about it in my new journal - 'too much'.  your words were very calming to me and i appreciated that a lot.  :hug:

San, I'm sad that things have been so hard and painful and overwhelming. "Too much" for sure.