Okay, so here's what happened:
I started seeing a new therapist in February/March. She explicitly said: "I always let my clients email me. If it gets to be a problem, we talk about it."
So, between February and June I sent a total of five emails, two of which she asked me to send. I put them all in one document, and it was seven pages, plus a comic book thing I did.
In June, I referenced the comic book, and she confessed she didn't read it, and that she hasn't read everything I sent.
I was taken aback, but just left it alone, but now notice I was starting to do things to desperately get her approval and hope there was SOMETHING about me she thought was acceptable. I finally brought it up at the beginning of August, and she gave me a line about it's not good to make assumptions (i.e. I shouldn't have assumed she'd read them) and I was left defending how I could even benefit from emailing.
I tried again the next week, and she has been better, but the gist was that she wants to be paid to read my emails, that her time is her own. She said she went back and checked and she "skimmed" most of them, but confessed she hadn't read them. I think she thinks this is all addressed, but I don't feel like it has been at all.
I just don't trust her now. I really don't understand what she was thinking at all with this. Does she ignore everyone's emails, or just mine? Is it just me who isn't worth listening to? I'm super hurt by this. Am I just over-sensitive? How is it at all respectful to someone to just skim what they communicate, much less this really personal stuff? And then NOT TELL them, so they continue to do it?
To me, I have such a hard time trusting, what I was sending in those emails was part of building that trust. So I'd go into session with that as a backdrop, assuming certain communication had happened. Ultimately, the relationship we had was a lie. Certain parts of it never happened, because she wasn't reading that stuff. So I was REALLY over-extended, and talking AS IF she was with me, but she really wasn't. The entire relationship to this point has been built on false assumptions. God, do I feel like a fool.
Then there's a big sense of betrayal. Not only was the stuff I shared about myself not worth her attention, but I wasn't even worth TELLING she wasn't paying it any attention. I feel like a complete fool. This is completely humiliating. I kept sending her REALLY personal stuff about me, while she knew the whole time she wasn't paying any attention to it. That seems so belittling and dismissive. I'm nothing and don't matter at all. I'm just pathetic and laughable.
I'm feeling utterly pathetic and worthless from this.
The thing is, she has shown a lot of understanding and insight into what I've told her about growing up, and is generally quite good while in session. She really seems to want to help. I don't want to throw that away if there's any way to correct this. But I'm not really getting anything that helps me get past this from her. And am I always going to have to worry about this now. She showed a fundamental dishonesty there, I think. What's to stop her from being like that again, and making sure I don't find out in the future? I really don't think she even thinks she did anything wrong, but apologized because I'm overly-sensitive and fragile. I had been feeling so optimistic I could get help from her!
Anyhow, I'm likely going to try one last time this Friday, and probably stop seeing her. I'm not sure if I'm just over-reacting. Is this just part of how I'm messed up? Even if it is, how can I get help there when she has shown I can't trust her? I think of going back and I just feel like garbage, I'm nothing, everything about me is hated and unwanted. I'm scared of her now more than before the first session. I just feel panicky thinking of going back. I think trying to resolve this is therapeutic, but only if she helps that. I don't even know what she could do to make that happen, though! My mind is all over the place with this. I'm scared to go, and scared to not go. I think there's some double bind in play here, actually...
I hope I'm not fixating too much on this. I'm feeling completely alone and super desperate. I guess all the little boys in me are too scared of her now, and badly hurt. Is the right thing for the father part of me to listen to them and not go back, or to take them "for their own good" in the hope she can find some way out of this?
Meursault
Personally, imo, if the little dudes are that scared of her right now I'd have a tendency to lean towards helping them. They've not been listened to/validated and I think it would be good for them to experience what that feels like. :hug:
You can always print something out for T to read in your presence or leave a few minutes early and hand it to her on the way out, if you feel a need to explain anything. That way you're honoring the IC's need for safety as well as your T's need to be paid as she prefers. I would be very tempted to tell her I wouldn't have emailed her in the first place unless she'd told me it was ok.
I always feel like decisions have to be made NOW, haha, I'm always telling myself to slow down. Take your time, you're not there to make her feel good, you don't owe her anything (besides paying the bill ;) )
I had a similar experience with one of the most professional psychiatric social workers I ever hired. The document I asked her to read was not anywhere near as long as yours. Record yourself reciting your 7 page document. Did it take over 45 minutes? I paid my T one half what a session would have cost to read my document because I felt I contained valuable insight into my psyche, a depth of feeling I might have stumbled and mumbled out of all contextual semblance. For me it was worth it at the time. Now I understand when a T says you can send an Email, what they want is just a line or two not an essay. Keep her or leave her. No T is going to read 7 pages without being paid for her time. As I have said in other threads you are her client, customer, patient not her friend. This is one of the only places you can get away with posting a 7 page document and have compassionate responses without being charged for it.
meursault - If you've been seeing her for several months now and your 'boys' feel even less safe with her, then that should be taken into consideration. I especially understand feeling vulnerable and undervalued as a result of her failure to respond.
I don't think I'm special, but the couple of therapists who asked me to write things out and bring them to session (before email was really big), would go over some of it during session and take the whole of my writing and put it into my file. The next session, he'd (usually male therapists) bring out the writings and we'd go over them again. I could tell he'd read them by the very focused questions he'd ask. I was not charged for anything but the standard sessions I attended.
My personal opinion is that she invited emails without discussing payment to read them. Failing to even acknowledge them, given the nature of therapy, feels unethical to me, given that she invited emails. IF she felt that a 7-page email was excessive, when she received it was the time to bring that up, and to request payment for reading at THAT time, not to wait until you brought it up.
These are just my opinions, but I would be upset and looking for another therapist had I been in your situation.
Three Roses:
Yeah, I had asked about the emailing our first session, and she said she always lets clients email. She said if there's a problem, we'd discuss it. She seemed taken aback that I thought it best to ask before I ever sent anything. I wouldn't have, otherwise (unless maybe during a crisis). I've been having a hard time with this since mid-June. I'm not an overly impulsive person, so I've been trying to work my way through the hurt of this without just ending it.
Wife#2:
I regularly bring in things and read them because I have a hard time keeping it all coherent. She sometimes puts them in the file. What you wrote just brought something back. I printed out a very graphic write-up about my Mom and sisters, and was going to get her to read it in session, but she took it and just put it in my file. It was the most detailed and personal stuff with my Mom and sisters. Now I wonder if she ever read it.
Danaus:
It wasn't that I had sent one seven page email document. She had asked me to send one thing, which was over two pages (a description of what I thought would be helpful in therapy), and asked for another which was a page ( a list of positives in my life), so over the four+ months, there were three unsolicited emails which totalled about three and a half pages. (Plus a comic that I drew, I suppose.) One was half a page, and the other two were a page and half each. (One of them was on the anniversary of my Dad's death and she had asked me to let her know what was happening with me emotionally that day, so really, I could argue that was asked for as well, but I don't really know.)
If I had sent a single paragraph every second week, it would have amounted to more text than what I actually sent unsolicited. That just doesn't seem too onerous to me. Really, it's not just that she didn't read them, but that she neither read them, nor told me she wasn't, while telling me it was fine to send them. Paying for her time is not an issue to me, and I would have gladly paid had she indicated it. What I have a problem with is being treated like I am irrelevant and worthless and can be treated without consideration.
Your comment actually kind of upsets me. Of COURSE it would be unreasonable to send a seven page document and expect her to sit down with it for an hour on her own time. Your comment is kind of misrepresenting what I wrote and making me look unreasonable. I am aware I'm not her friend, as well. I am paying her for a service, and when she indicated what the protocol for emailing was, she had a professional duty to stand by that. If she didn't like what was transpiring, she should have done as she said she would, and talk to me, rather than letting me blindly humiliate myself sending deeply personal stuff into the void.
Can I assume you just misread what I wrote? Otherwise I think what you wrote could be summed up as this: I said something deeply personal. You twisted what I said to look like something completely irrational. You then lectured (belittled) me for holding that misrepresentation. Echoes of emotional abuse there.
Meursault
I'll first quote the parts that I think are relevant to the e-mail agreement:
Quote from: meursault on August 29, 2016, 04:00:50 PM
I started seeing a new therapist in February/March. She explicitly said: "I always let my clients email me. If it gets to be a problem, we talk about it."
OK.
Her initiative.
QuoteSo, between February and June I sent a total of five emails, two of which she asked me to send.
Right. She even specifically asks you to send her e-mails.
Quoteshe hasn't read everything I sent.
Yet she hasn't told you. That
does seem to contradict her statement "If it gets to be a problem, we talk about it", since
she didn't talk about it.
QuoteI finally brought it up at the beginning of August, and she gave me a line about it's not good to make assumptions (i.e. I shouldn't have assumed she'd read them) and I was left defending how I could even benefit from emailing.
In My Honest Opinion (IMHO), you were not making assumptions, she has created expectations. I could be wrong though. Suffice to say I would have made the same 'assumptions' as you did.
QuoteI tried again the next week, and she has been better, but the gist was that she wants to be paid to read my emails, that her time is her own. She said she went back and checked and she "skimmed" most of them, but confessed she hadn't read them. I think she thinks this is all addressed, but I don't feel like it has been at all.
If she wants to be paid for reading your e-mails, she should have:
- said so when she offered the possibility of you sending e-mails, i.e.: she should have told you it was a business proposal
apart from the business-deal you already had agreed to (meaning you paying for face-to-face therapy)
- told you after receiving your first e-mail: "I've read it, here's the bill." (which I would personally still feel would have been inappropriate, but then at least you would have known from then on what the 'deal' was)
- told you upfront in the case of the "two [mails] she asked me to send" that there would be an additional charge.
That's the facts as I see them.
Relating to you emotional response (which is as factual and real as the 'business' side of things):
QuoteI just don't trust her now. I really don't understand what she was thinking at all with this. Does she ignore everyone's emails, or just mine? Is it just me who isn't worth listening to? I'm super hurt by this. Am I just over-sensitive? How is it at all respectful to someone to just skim what they communicate, much less this really personal stuff? And then NOT TELL them, so they continue to do it?
Right. You're not being over-sensitive IMHO, you're being' just right'-sensitive. She can't allude to it being OK, or even preferable (as in the case of the two e-mails), to you sending e-mails and then ignore them, or at the very least not giving them much attention. And keeping her mouth shut over it.
QuoteTo me, I have such a hard time trusting, what I was sending in those emails was part of building that trust. So I'd go into session with that as a backdrop, assuming certain communication had happened.
Of course you did. For what it's worth: I would have done the very same thing.
QuoteUltimately, the relationship we had was a lie. Certain parts of it never happened, because she wasn't reading that stuff. So I was REALLY over-extended, and talking AS IF she was with me, but she really wasn't. The entire relationship to this point has been built on false assumptions. God, do I feel like a fool.
The bolded part is your Inner Critic speaking, IMHO.
I really love the American (?) saying: Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. So, this is her being a fool, not you. But that's just me. I'm not a T.
QuoteThen there's a big sense of betrayal. Not only was the stuff I shared about myself not worth her attention, but I wasn't even worth TELLING she wasn't paying it any attention.
Right!
Quote[...]That seems so belittling and dismissive.
Right!
QuoteI'm nothing and don't matter at all. I'm just pathetic and laughable.
Is the messages she sends indeed. IMHO, and the Inner Critic has a field day with it. Says the cPTSD person in me.
QuoteThe thing is, she has shown a lot of understanding and insight into what I've told her about growing up, and is generally quite good while in session. She really seems to want to help. I don't want to throw that away if there's any way to correct this. But I'm not really getting anything that helps me get past this from her. And am I always going to have to worry about this now. She showed a fundamental dishonesty there, I think. What's to stop her from being like that again, and making sure I don't find out in the future? I really don't think she even thinks she did anything wrong, but apologized because I'm overly-sensitive and fragile. I had been feeling so optimistic I could get help from her!
Right!
If your in-session meetings are still valuable to you, great. Possibly take everything you can get out of those. But I can really relate to the violation of trust you have experienced. Ditch the e-mail 'agreement' for sure.
QuoteAnyhow, I'm likely going to try one last time this Friday, and probably stop seeing her. I'm not sure if I'm just over-reacting. Is this just part of how I'm messed up?
IMHO, no.
QuoteEven if it is, how can I get help there when she has shown I can't trust her?
A valid concern.
QuoteI think of going back and I just feel like garbage, I'm nothing, everything about me is hated and unwanted. I'm scared of her now more than before the first session. I just feel panicky thinking of going back. I think trying to resolve this is therapeutic, but only if she helps that. I don't even know what she could do to make that happen, though! My mind is all over the place with this. I'm scared to go, and scared to not go. I think there's some double bind in play here, actually...
Right! If you feel this bad about it, please do pay attention to it. For all the 'brokenness' we feel at times, we are not delusional. A double bind eh... Those are tricky ones. You may well be right on that too, though I'm in no position to judge. I've only grown aware of the concept of a "double bind" myself a year or so ago.
QuoteI hope I'm not fixating too much on this. I'm feeling completely alone and super desperate. I guess all the little boys in me are too scared of her now, and badly hurt. Is the right thing for the father part of me to listen to them and not go back, or to take them "for their own good" in the hope she can find some way out of this?
Sticking to Pete Walker's concept of self-fathering (paraphrased and abridged): "the father's role is to provide safety for the children". Whether in this case providing safety means not exposing your "little boys" at all to her, or whether it means he will join them going into that room with her, stand back initially (while observing what goes on in his little boys/sons, NOT te T.!)) and standing up for his "ittle boys/sons when she again puts her in their harm's way I cannot tell.
Either will do, I surmise.
:hug:
Dutch Uncle:
Thanks for what you wrote. It means a lot to me.
Danaus:
I guess I didn't explain well initially. I thought it was pretty clear, but it appears everyone misread that. I'm pretty upset still, but I'm sorry if my comment to you was harsh. I think I should just stop talking. I'm just misunderstood, anyways.
F* I just feel like giving up on everything.
Meursault
ohh, Meursault, please don't give up!
The whole point of my post was to try to encourage you to stand up for your rights to be heard! You deserve to be heard! Whether it's in person or via email. I hear you and want to keep hearing you! Maybe it is *I* and not you who didn't explain well.
I don't like this therapist. She's made you feel lesser instead of helping you find your way to better! That is NOT what we sign up for when we hire a therapist! Your inner boys don't like her anymore and I think their judgment is spot-on. Not all therapists are good, not all are good people in fact. This one wasn't honest in the beginning and didn't follow through as she ought. Some are WONDERFUL and when you find one of those, you'll know it. You deserve one who listens to you, values YOUR time - the time you took to write these things to help her gain insight, and genuinely tries to help you.
Please know we do care and that we do hope there is peace and comfort in your future!
Please don't give up! Keep talking, we are listening.
:cheer: :cheer:
meursault,
i don't blame you one bit for not trusting her anymore. i don't think she was very upfront and honest with you about the emails, don't think she was clear about expectations and boundaries, and those things are paramount in a therapeutic relationship. and, i can totally see how you would feel like you've been put in a double-bind situation. she's really good during a session, yet she dismisses and ignores what you present to her in writing. what is that!!!
from my perspective, you're not the fool. i hate seeing this stuff happen in my profession, but i'm seeing and hearing about it more and more. ugh! no wonder people are wary, unsure, scared, and mistrusting of seeing a therapist! but, i agree, there are many, many very good therapists out there who care and are careful, who are continually aware of putting their client's interests and welfare first. the number one rule in any helping profession is 'first, do no harm.' every good therapist takes that to heart, and makes sure on every level possible that they are following that rule.
it sounds like your little boys know what they're talking about. i see no credible reason to be afraid of a therapist, except that s/he has set the stage for that fear. and, to my mind, that's just not right. best of luck with this. i also want to repeat, please don't give everything up. we want and need you here. you've been a valuable source of insight and support, and i'd hate to lose that.
I've calmed down somewhat. Sorry for the negativity.
Thanks for the comments cPTSDers! I ended up emailing my therapist my original post in this thread, and said I'd like her to read it and think about it before our next session, and I'd pay for an hour of her time. I had a friend read it, and it took him four minutes. I said if she was unable, we will have to reschedule until after she reads it. Maybe that was stupid. I can't keep this stuff straight in my head when I'm face to face and being challenged, though. Either I don't go back, or I go back with her already fully informed about what I'm feeling. I didn't want to just bring it in and read it or have her read it, because my sense of her is that she gets a bit defensive and reacts hastily, so I want her to be at her professional best after reflecting on it.
Even if it screws me up, the father part of me is taking charge here and trying to resolve it. Hopefully, I am validated and valued, or if not, I stand up for myself and leave rather than just giving up and internalizing the message that I'm a worthless piece of s* like I normally would. So much stuff takes practice to get better, I'll look at this as practice, and if it goes wrong, I'll try to understand how. I don't know if I can continue with her regardless of what happens, trust is hard to rebuild, but I think some resolution might help anyhow.
(Maybe tomorrow this will seem impossible, but that's my plan as of now!) I hope I can make this an exercise where the boy parts of me are able to remain relatively calm and witness the father part of me looking after them, so they learn a bit more that they can be safe. I found the father part in me, but the boy parts are pretty overwhelming emotionally. I think that teaching them there is a part of me who can love and protect them is important. I think your advice there was really good, Dutch Uncle! At the very least, I'd like to understand a bit why she didn't think it was important to read what I sent. I went from feeling tons of self-hatred and suicidal ideation to this. I think the father part asserted himself, sent her the email, and basically said "This is what we are doing! What she does isn't relevant, because I'll be there." He better show up on Friday, or Team Meursault is in big trouble!
Wife#2:
I really sorry! I wasn't directing my despair at you in my earlier post. You're comments are nothing but supportive, and I thank you for them.
Sanmagic:
The sad thing is, I think she's the third best mental health professional I've ever seen. I'm sure we all have horror stories!
Three Roses:
I hope my issue isn't filtering into your thoughts about tomorrow. I hope you have a good first session! This feels like a marriage. It has been mostly good for me, but my spouse has cheated on me now, and I don't know if I can move past that. It was still worth getting married, though!
I don't know, maybe I was crazy to send her that. I guess I'll see. I'm feeling like I had to do something. The self-loathing and internalization was pretty bad the last day or so. I'm trying to face it all head on.
Meursault
i don't think you were crazy to do what you did. i think you're setting boundaries and putting out your expectations clearly. my best to you for this. i believe you will get some kind of pos. resolution, one way or the other, cuz i think your 'dad' you is taking good care of your 'boys' you. we're here for all of you all the way. and, not to worry about the negativity. i'm just glad you had a place to put it.
Quote from: meursault on August 31, 2016, 02:52:56 AM
I think the father part asserted himself, sent her the email, and basically said "This is what we are doing! What she does isn't relevant, because I'll be there." He better show up on Friday, or Team Meursault is in big trouble!
I'm pretty sure he will show up, dear Meursault.
Will he act perfectly? Maybe not. But he'll try, and give it his best.
It will be new for him to do so, and it will be new to your "boys inside" to meet him like that. Or perhaps for your "boys inside" it will be a bit awkward to see him showing up again, after some time.
I hope, wish and trust that
if "Team Meursault" will end up in trouble, they will end up doing so as a team. :grouphug:
Obviously I hope and wish they score a few point at least, as a team.
A winning point would be best, but just scoring some points might do wonders for the team-spirit.
Wishing you well, grabbing "The Cup" takes a season to complete,
:hug:
Dutch.
I'm actually feeling fortified by your story here, Meursault! To see you gain the.., well, whatever it is you needed to be able to face this head-on is truly encouraging.
We'll be cheering for Team Meursault!
:cheer: :applause:
:yeahthat: Sorry for my insensitivity and bad math. Two months ago I was complaining about my shrink when he told me I was sick, I had a disease and medicine was not going to cure me. Now I'm going through SSRI withdrawal and griping about that in another thread. In both instances everybody here has been very supportive. I should have followed their example. You're not the first to bring me up on charges of a lack of compassion. If only there was a pill I could take for that. I don't enjoy stepping on toes. I'm just unskilled.
BIG HUGS, DANAUS
Danaus:
No worries! You're going through your own stuff and that's hard too. But I really need compassion from people. This is a place I come hoping to find that understanding. Since you say you have a history with your comments being perceived as lacking compassion, can you just not comment on what I say in the future? I found a lot of what you said implicitly very demeaning. I don't mean I'm not reading what you write in various threads or anything, but I'd rather you not comment on my situations and difficulties.
Thanks,
Meursault
Quote from: Danaus plexippus on September 01, 2016, 07:32:39 PM
:yeahthat: Sorry for my insensitivity and bad math. Two months ago I was complaining about my shrink when he told me I was sick, I had a disease and medicine was not going to cure me. Now I'm going through SSRI withdrawal and griping about that in another thread. In both instances everybody here has been very supportive. I should have followed their example. You're not the first to bring me up on charges of a lack of compassion. If only there was a pill I could take for that. I don't enjoy stepping on toes. I'm just unskilled.
Folks, as difficult as these situations are we
can learn from them. Danaus, I applaud you for apologizing and having the awareness that you may need to choose your words more carefully and watch your tone in some of your post. Most of us grew up in homes where people spoke to us in less than positive ways and we had to take it. Here we can talk about our feelings and set boundaries as you have done Meursault and in a clear, firm but respectful manner.
Part of recovering entails bumps in the road such as this one, what counts is what we do about it in the end. Apologizing, taking responsibility, setting boundaries - all recovery oriented imo so maybe that's what you can both take away from this.
My two cents FWIW.
Well, I had therapy today.
I was in a bit of a state throughout, dissociating, shaking, crying. I kind of feel like crying now even, when I'm thinking how I asked, very desperately and panicky: "What's so bad about me that people are allowed to hurt me and I'm wrong for having a problem with it?" The father part of me was there sporadically. I think I left "the boys" to fend for themselves a bit much, I'm afraid.
Anyhow, I am going to go back and try. I told her I don't know if I can trust her again, but I'll try. I have a hard time knowing what I feel or think yet, though. I think the fact she wasn't putting me down or freaking out on me just seems like enough of a relief from a woman that I can't accurately appraise what I think yet, and I'll be dealing with this for a while before I really know.
She was pretty emphatic that she screwed up. She said she didn't realize how important it was to me until this week and she thought more about it. She said she screwed up and should have dealt with this after the first email, but was worried about hurting me because I'm so easy to hurt. She said she realized what she did actually caused more hurt than anything else. I think that's as close to an answer as I'll get, so I will have to sit with it and feel out what I feel. She basically said she messed up and made a mistake because she's human, and there wasn't any excuse, since I was actually telling her what I needed, but she wasn't hearing it, when she should have since that's her role and she's supposed to be the one responsible for that aspect of therapy.
There was some of it that descended into argument, which I had no interest in and just shut down, but I think she was pretty forthright. There was some defensiveness on her part. She was at some conference last week, and she asserted a few times how she is very empathic and understanding and a good therapist, and how many of the other Ts at the conference were clueless. That came up after I had mentioned that I went for a coffee with an old high school friend who is a therapist and was one of my Ts instructors for some course, and how my old friend recommended finding a new T based off of something she had said to me. The comment was how she said I'm suicidal for attention and now I can't talk to her if I'm suicidal, so my old friend said she'd never say that to a client and I should find another T. T said she didn't mean it that way, and I had one interpretation because of the trauma from my Mom (hence irrational?), she had another, and if anyone else listened, they would have yet another. Isn't that sort of saying there is no truth in interpreting comments as abusive or invalidating? Sort of "I'm not being abusive, that's just your perception!"
Anyhow, just writing this, I don't want to go back now. I'm bouncing all over. And she was saying she messed up because she's a "people pleaser". That was fundamentally her reason for not dealing with this properly. Isn't that essentially saying "I hurt you because I'm a nice person."? Is that not a bad thing to say? Isn't that: "I hurt you because I care"? I'm feeling pretty confused there. I know my hyper-vigilance and expectation of attack are ridiculously high now, so I think my interpretations are pretty unforgiving, which is probably a bit unfair (probably true with Danaus here as well). Can I trust enough now to relax that trauma response?
Anyhow, I guess this is me beginning to think about what happened today... I'm pretty muddled.
Meursault
Meursault you're my hero!
You did great. You've got this.
I'm sorry you went through this, but you know what? sometimes it is so important to discover how strong and resilient and wise we can be,even from the inside of a truckload of trauma.
Kudos my friend. This was a tough one and you did yourself proud. :fireworks:
You did great!! :waveline:
I think I'd definitely think about finding another one, if that's feasible. It's hard to say, not being there to read body language/vocal inflection, but a few of those comments sound way off base to me.
Thanks! I was feeling kind of giddy after it was done. I think I was maybe proud of myself for (somewhat) handling it, too. I can't sleep tonight now, it's all stressing me out. I think I need a heuristic to apply to my life: If I need another therapist to talk about what's happening in therapy, it's time to move on. I'm such a worrier and I'm not prone to rash decisions usually, so I'm still having a hard time committing to leaving. I really want to talk it out with another therapist! I suppose since it's hours later and I don't feel I should go back, I know what to do. I'm just scared to commit to it in case it's a mistake and I'm just doing something self destructive.
Meursault
The way you talk about it, the way you share your experiences, the way you self-reflect on what is happening... I honestly belief that when you make a decision to move on, grounded in all that, it cannot be a mistake.
Quote from: meursault on September 03, 2016, 07:31:27 AM
If I need another therapist to talk about what's happening in therapy, it's time to move on.
:yes:
:hug:
Thanks, Dutch Uncle. I appreciate the comment! I've been mulling this all day, and wrote a goodbye letter. I'm still uncertain. I just think I'm willing to work through this if this is exactly the kind of repair work that will help me get better. Is resolving this, and then healing from it the sort of thing that my damaged attachment needs to do? Damned. I totally need another therapist to work this out! I'd really appreciate your input, Sanmagic, if you have anything you'd like to mention!
Meursault
Quote from: meursault on September 03, 2016, 11:42:21 PM
I'm still uncertain. I just think I'm willing to work through this if this is exactly the kind of repair work that will help me get better. Is resolving this, and then healing from it the sort of thing that my damaged attachment needs to do?
I may read this the wrong way, but are you thinking that it's perhaps better to stay with her, while you don't feel safe with her, feel she is inattentive and have other unpleasant feelings relating to her? That this would be an opportunity to work with her through feeling unsafe (in general), inattentiveness and other 'issues' you might have in general?
When you put it that way.....it doesn't make sense.
I am pretty confused. My last therapist was awesome, and she told me that a lot of what actually helps healing in rherapy is working through "repair" with the therapist. Of course, with her, I would tell her something, and then spend a week in terror and panic, expecting to come back and finding her full or rage and ridicule and dismissiveness. I would come back, though, and she would still be caring and accepting. It's possible I'm equating two things I shouldn't. I often felt unsafe with her, but she never did anything to make me feel that way. I often felt like she didn't care, but that was never indicated by any of her actions. I was learning my expectations were wrong.
I guess with her, I was working through feeling unsafe, even though I was safe, but with the current therapist I'm wondering if I should work through it even though I actually think I am unsafe. I want to stop, and that feels right, but I'm basically afraid that this is missing what the old tehrapist thinks is prime territory for healing. I don't feel comfortable with her responses, though. I maybe did the healing part: asserting how it hurt me, defining boundaries, challenging mistreatment etc. Maybe that's all the good I can get out of it, since her response wasn't adding much past that. I've learned my expectations were not wrong.
Meursault
You've got the answers inside of you.
Whatever they are, it's about trusting yourself now.
Quote from: meursault on September 04, 2016, 07:15:05 AM
I want to stop, and that feels right, but I'm basically afraid that this is missing what the old tehrapist thinks is prime territory for healing. I don't feel comfortable with her responses, though. I maybe did the healing part: asserting how it hurt me, defining boundaries, challenging mistreatment etc. Maybe that's all the good I can get out of it, since her response wasn't adding much past that. I've learned my expectations were not wrong.
I'd say that may well be a valid assessment.
I have very little experience with therapy, but I think in any case there's always room for a 'break' or a period of 'taking it easy'. It's not a race. Well, not a sprint in any case.
And it's probably fine to switch 'coaches' (i.e. therapists) now and then.
The psychologists I did see never got to even giving me a diagnosis, but the talks I did have did provide me with something, even if it wasn't much and I was left to fend for myself once more. And so I moved on and got here. ;D
If it's any comfort to you: I will first need to work through my TherapistMom with a therapist before I can work with a therapist on the other stuff... Though working through the therapy I received from TherapistMom is probably the major issue anyway.
In this section there are a few more threads on 'dealing with therapy/therapists", perhaps you'll find some experiences you can relate to there. And there is also a thread called I need therapy just to go to therapy (http://outofthefog.net/C-PTSD/forum/index.php?topic=543.msg3766#msg3766) by some other members. Perhaps you'll find that useful.
Good luck, take your time and I wish you well.
Dutch.
hey, meursault, i heard you!
from everything you said, i agree with others to trust yourself on this one. i've heard too many alarm bells. if a therapist messes up, s/he messes up, will acknowledge it, be accountable for it, apologize, and let you know that it won't happen again. that's what any healthy person in any healthy relationship would do. there would be no excuses (i'm a people pleaser), no putting you on the defensive, no trying to make you see their side of the situation. it's as simple as i screwed up, i'm sorry, i won't let it happen again.
i think a lot of your confusion is because she said confusing things to you. she didn't want to deal with the email issue because she was afraid of hurting you, then realized that she hurt you more by not dealing with it? well, to me, that's plain old gobbledy-gook. she didn't realize it was so important to you? a good therapist realizes that everything a client brings up in session is important - everything a client says is a message to the therapist. everything a client does or doesn't do is a message to the therapist. a good therapist is an interpreter of human behavior, a translator of human language.
and a good therapist chooses words, intonations, body language and everything else that goes into conveying a message clearly to the client so that said client will not misinterpret what s/he is saying. a good therapist will also often convey the message different ways using different words, examples, metaphors, etc. the t will also often ask if the client understands, and have the client repeat back what that understanding is in the client's mind. the idea of her telling you that everyone has their own interpretation, that that's not what she meant means, to me, that she didn't do her job correctly. she is the one who must know what message she wants to get across, and then do everything possible to make sure the client receives that exact message. that's the t's job.
it sounds like her issues have gotten in the way of being able to do what you needed done for you. and what was that 'suicidal for attention' statement about? or that she didn't want you to talk to her if you were suicidal? (that's rhetorical). that just doesn't make any sense to me. i've never heard such a phrase before, and i hope never to hear it again!
as far as therapeutic repair goes, your example with your other t denoted your own inaccurate projections, thoughts, beliefs, and worries that were repaired through the experience of repeatedly going to see that therapist and finding out that what was in your mind was untrue. you were able to repair yourself because both the therapist and the therapeutic relationship were strong and righteous. it was your thought processes that needed repairing. your t remained constant in her acceptance of and caring about you, which enable you to repair what was maladjusted.
in this case, it's the therapist who needs the repair done, and that's not up to you to do, mainly because you can't. it isn't in your power. there is an inherent imbalance of power in the therapeutic relationship where the t has more power than the client. a good t takes that power and uses it for the good of the client. it doesn't work the other way around, because the client doesn't have the power to do the same for the t. if a t is attempting to give that kind of power to a client, to help him/her with personal problems, that's just wrong. so, no, there is no therapeutic repair work to be done here by you.
in fact, meursault, you've done some mighty fine repair work on yourself in spite of your t! congrats on that! personally, i think this t is someone you don't need, is someone who has dropped the ball when it came to putting your best interests first, and someone you can walk away from without another thought. if you think a letter of explanation is important for you, yourself, that's one thing. you owe her no explanations because it sounds like you gave her plenty in your last session. you can simply cancel your next appointment and look for someone else. you're clean and clear, as far as i can see.
and, just one last awwww, meursault - thanks so much for asking for my input. i'm smiling with appreciation and the feeling of being honored by you. i'm happy if this helped you in any way. i think you're doing really good. well done!
Good to hear what you think, Sanmagic...
I think it's actually obvious what to do, but I am so used to believing I'm wrong about everything, I'm scared to. I'm eventually going to be able to go back to the old awesome therapist as well, and I was really wanting to make her proud of how I was actively working on getting help and stuff!!! Looking at it, I kept this to myself trying to find some understanding of it for a month and a half. Then I told her, it has been a subject matter for every session since, and it was over a month before I sent her what I wrote originally to start this topic. I notice that only when I indicate I am likely going to leave, does she finally confess to messing up.
A month ago, I even said: "Imagine if you call someone, and they say hello, then set down the phone on the table as you go and tell them all sorts of personal and important stuff, and then you only discover that they did that by an offhand comment they make months later. That's what you did." She is saying she never understood until I sent the post that started this thread. I don't see how that's possible.
I think you're right. Leaving is more therapeutic to me than staying. It really sucks, because when she is in session, she really seems enthusiastic and has quite a bit of insight. Really, more than anything, I think it's mostly that I've been grateful she didn't fly into a rage at me or ridicule me when I told her about my Mom.
I suppose I just have no belief she wants to hear anything I say or feel anymore. Just the fact that she is an attractive woman was providing some good experience and exposure. Hey, an attractive woman was listening to my feelings and not attacking me, it was awesome. I just think it will damage me going forward now.
It's kind of screwed up that I've basically spent the last month/month and a half paying her to try to get her to understand how she hurt me and treated me badly. Probably $750. And her solution going forward is to have the regular 1.5 hour session at $150, and schedule in a weekly hour at $100 just for reading anything I send. $250 a week! And I am undoubtedly going to be working through this for months! So what would I be looking at? All the fear and degradation and self-loathing, plus paying her four or five thousand dollars, because she didn't do me the courtesy of reading what I sent, when she indicated it wasn't a problem. And now constantly on guard for more signs I'm not safe and can't trust her.
God, I feel dumb! Lol...
Thinking about it, if I had that job, and clients were sending me stuff like I did... an occasional page or so about their thoughts and feelings, I think I would be interested and curious to find out more about them and how I could help. She had given me a printout of attachment stuff that had thought bubbles with a cartoon baby reaching for its Mom. One of the thoughts was "I need you to delight in me." I have no illusions of my actual importance to her, but I think that's something we all need from therapy to some degree.
I am going in for one last session. It will be good. Now the father part has made a decision, the little boys in me don't have to worry! This has had me messed up for quite a while. I wish she was just a generally terrible therapist, as this would have been easy!
Thanks again Sanmagic! And that's for all the support from everyone else. It really helps to talk this stuff out!
Meursault
you're more than welcome, meursault. you sound much stronger now, and i know everything will be fine. and, i'm so happy for you that you'll have your 'awesome' t back. yay! keep taking care of you. you're worth it.
I think I should shut up on this subject after this... sorry for the length of this, but I suppose I'll share the "exciting conclusion" of my therapy...
So. During the last session, my therapist mentioned several times about how I presented differently in my email than in person. I wasn't sure what she meant. I kind of wanted to understand that "presented" stuff before seeing her a final time. She has mentioned since the email thing arose that she intended it for short messages, rescheduling etc. so I assumed a quick question asking for clarification was reasonable, so I sent this:
"It's been bugging me since I left, since I didn't really understand. You said I present quite differently in my emails compared to in person. I don't need the whole thing explained, but I was wondering if you could quickly let me know how it's different? I'm not really sure, since I think I feel like I'm the same."
She sent a long (a page-ish) response describing what she meant, which also had conjectures about my motivation with regard to this stuff that was way off. She went into a lot of detail about my personal stuff vis-a-vis women, my Mom etc. She then "PS"ed it letting me know that this was exactly the kind of unacceptable emailing she was talking about, and we would discuss it further on Friday. Completely discounting my request, while mentioning how she wants to validate my feelings in her message. She also mentions respecting her boundaries. She's the one that changed the boundaries again, AFAIC.
I sent:
"Ok. I don't understand anything. I thought it was just a quick question to clarify something. This is just too unpredictable and causing me too much hurt and panic. I have no idea where boundaries are with you or what the rules are. I think I'm just going to stop seeing you. Could I come in Wednesday around noon and pick up my photos and pay you for that half hour?"
(I had brought in some pictures of me as a boy (and a couple of me and my one good ex-girlfriend), which I mentioned I wouldn't have been back last time if she hadn't had them, and she joked that she's holding them hostage. She also accidentally underbilled me.) I was feeling kind of relieved by ending it.
She sent:
"I can see you at noon on Wednesday but I would like us to have some time to talk as I feel that the work we have done and can continue to do together is worth a conversation and I wouldn't want to throw away the opportunity. I think we can make it through this difficult time and I think you deserve it. Having said that, I want to honour your wishes as well. I would like you to think about what each part of you wishes (maybe looking at the drawing you created that identified the versions of [Meursault] who have been hurt along the way) and perhaps we can talk about it on Wednesday. I just have a hard time understanding that this is truly what you want."
Again, completely discounting me. She is incredulous that I mean it when I say I don't want to come back, and muddles and confuses me by questioning my wishes by suggesting parts of me want to come back. Sort of: "yeahyeahyeah, you don't REALLY mean it." *She's not hearing me, still!
At this point I'm flustered and agree to just come back on Friday. I become more agitated and panicky, and I'm worrying and catastrophizing about other things.
She then sends:
"Okay that sounds good. I will see you Friday at 12. Please consider looking at the feelings and wishes of those parts in the drawing though. I think its important that they feel heard and validated. See you in a few days"
By this point, I am officially in a "tizzy". Everything is incoherent and nothing makes sense. I don't understand anything. Isn't SHE the one doing therapy via email here? The drawing she refers to was a comic style picture I drew with a bunch of Me's of different ages introducing themselves and telling her how they feel scared and want to be able to trust her etc. but don't know yet. I am currently not being heard or validated, and she says "I think its important that they feel heard and validated" This is crazy-making. Gaslighting? Double-think?
I send:
"I can't come back. You are communicating so many conflicting things just in this email exchange alone, I can't handle this. Goodbye."
Quite a while later, she tries calling and leaves a message to call her. Then when I didn't respond, she emails me saying if she doesn't hear from me she will contact my emergency person (unfortunately I put my Mom, the monster herself), and the cops unless I get a hold of her and assure her I'm not suicidal. She says she doesn't want me to feel trapped. I respond I am trapped. I tell her if I am suicidal, I can call the crisis line. She says "It sounds like you are fine and have have a plan if it changes. Thanks for letting me know." More crazy-making. She thanks me after threatening to call the cops and my Mom if I don't! Like this was some normal conversation where I had a choice!
I guess I was stupid for asking for clarification. I thought it was a simple thing, and could only help me understand if there was some way out of this to fix things, or help me end things better. I was expecting something like: "You appear more confident in your emails" or "You seem more vulnerable and open in them". Turns out she thinks I come across as more self-deprecating, insecure, and younger. She also said she saw a lot of anger in the email which I posted to start this thread. There was some, for sure, but I wasn't particularly angry. More earnest.
Either that, or she would let me know where the boundary was. Not cross it herself, and then chastise me for it. I kind of got blamed for her actions!
Anyhow, it's probably all my own fault. I should have predicted that would happen. Did I self-sabotage there? Was that something I should have seen coming, but just blindly ignored? I know there are problems with emailing, but last session she said she had been thinking "something short, like if you have to reschedule." Should I have taken that to mean ONLY if I have to reschedule? I guess so. Then I think how she has texted me names of books etc to read a few times seeing her. Her boundaries are baffling, changeable, sporadically enforced, different for her than me, and I don't understand at all. My mind is a maelstrom, and shattered into pieces right now.
Meursault
This
is crazy making, meursault.
IMHO you are not self-sabotaging at all, and you
did get the clarification you were asking for. Unfortunately the clarity is a different one you hoped for.
Quote from: meursault on September 06, 2016, 03:52:00 AM
(I had brought in some pictures of me as a boy (and a couple of me and my one good ex-girlfriend), which I mentioned I wouldn't have been back last time if she hadn't had them, and she joked that she's holding them hostage. She also accidentally underbilled me.) I was feeling kind of relieved by ending it.
Both are red flags.
The hostage joke is outright rude. These are personal items of you, one doesn't 'joke around' with those. She's messing with your mind, instead of easing your mind.
The rest of what you've written sounds equally bad.
You are doing the right thing by ending this.
:hug:
Well, I think I can say that she did more damage than anything by seeing her. I'm worse now than when I started. I wish I could understand this better, but I think I'm just going to have to keep seeing it as something is so wrong with me, I invite this treatment. Looking back, I was actually communicating my needs with all this stuff throughout, but wasn't being heard. Then the dismissiveness. And the unpredictability and having to worry about her perspective, when I shouldn't have had that concern at all. Then all the conflicting messages. The things that were hurtfully done, while the words were saying the opposite. I still don't understand this. Then: "do what I say or I'll call the cops" sort of thing. A few years ago, I stood up for myself with a woman and told her to get out of my life. She tried to force her way into my apartment to talk about it, but I shouldered the door shut. She called the cops and told them I had guns in my place and was suicidal. They sent a whole tactical unit and arrested me (later released). They didn't find any guns, but I got evicted over it.
I spent the whole time seeing the t deciding I might be wrong and I wasn't just garbage, so I kept trusting and talking to her, figuring my fears and distrust were just my trauma talking. Now I don't think I can trust a therapist again. What a waste of my time/money and all that emotional work, just to have her reinforce how worthless I am. I clearly don't have the ability to read whether someone is safe. I showed her who I am and she thought it was all right to treat that person like crap.
In short: dismissed, invalidated, unheard, arbitrary boundaries, conflicting messages, vulnerable, misunderstood, hurt, constantly having to defend and assert my need to be heard. Some echoes of childhood in all this. Just more devaluation from a woman. I'm really going to need a therapist to deal with this, I hope that good one takes me back! I feel like I'm going to have to start all over with her to see if I can trust her again as well!
Life: :spooked:
Meursault
It's not you.
There are a whole lot of wounded people who have no insight and offload their issues onto others, (along with downright dangerous people) out there. We can learn to recognise them and to protect ourselves from them.
I'm so sorry you've been so harmed by in your FOO where you should have been safe, and that part of that harm was not learning to know automatically, without even thinking, that you are important, and you and your feelings matter and to automatically enforce bondaries when you aren't treated with the respect you deserve. That's on them, not you.
It's a big part of cPTSD for so many of us. It often means we get badly hurt many times, but it doesn't make other people's bad behaviour our fault, it just means we need to help each other to learn what we should have learned in loving, healthy families.
You have done so well with this. It's been really tough, I know, but I've been in awe of how well you've done. I've been harmed in the past by toxic therapy and I know how hard it is.
Hang in there.
hey, meursault,
i was sucked in by an extremely bad therapist myself, was not only re-traumatized, but ended up far worse mentally and emotionally for the experience. it took me 8 yrs. to be able to report her to the state board. i ended up on meds for depression and anxiety, and my entire family was traumatized. in one sense, i'm grateful to her because she taught me how NOT to be a therapist.
this wasn't you, it's not self-sabotage, it's non-therapy from a bad therapist. you have been able to recognize what's been going on, you showed your strength and determination in this matter through your posts, and you are taking care of yourself by getting out from under her clutches. she deserves to be reported. she induces trauma rather than helping to alleviate it (as is her job), she denies and undermines your attempts to set boundaries or speak to your reality, and she is purposefully confusing you so as to get you to return, as if there is a way to 'fix' the situation by re-looking at yourself through her eyes.
remember i talked about an imbalance of power in the therapeutic relationship? while this was happening to me with my awful t, i was taking a therapeutic ethics course in grad school and asked the prof about fault and blame, especially regarding the client. he emphatically told the class that the client is NEVER to blame for what goes wrong in therapy. the t is the one who runs the entire show, and is culpable for anything that goes amiss. that helped me a lot to hear that. i hope it helps you, too.
how important are those pictures to you? are they worth being in her presence again while she spews her vile venom? saying she was 'holding them hostage', to my mind, is a threat. you can add that to the list of her wrongdoing. if it were me, i'd send her an email telling her to send those pictures to you or you're going to report her to whatever governing/licensing body for therapists there is in your area. and, if you're up to it, now or in the future, you can report her anyway, even if she sends the photos back to you. she doesn't deserve to be in a 'helping' profession. she's violated the number one rule: first do no harm.
pardon my anger, but this stuff really gets my goat. people like her give my profession a bad name, which makes it more difficult for those who need help to trust that someone truly does have their best interests at heart. i'm am so awfully sorry this has happened to you. and i hate it that she did this to you. you didn't deserve it, didn't ask for it, and in no way did you provoke it. it's all on her. i'm so glad you're getting out. please do so as painlessly as possible. i'm just fearful that if you have to see her again, she will heap more muck onto you. you owe her nothing to get those pictures back.
Hmm. a couple of months ago, I remember her saying something like: "I used to feel bad when clients would stop, wondering what I could have done differently. I now know some people just aren't ready for therapy." I remember thinking at the time: "Then you have made yourself immune from wrongdoing or criticism, and can't improve your own response."
I don't know how she'll view all this. I think I was pretty clear throughout. Sometimes I took a while to feel brave enough to mention something, but still... I'm completely scrambled and fractured mentally by all the mixed messages and confusion and reality-denying of this. I let her see so much of me, and she thinks it's all right to treat me like I'm nothing.
I don't think she's a bad person at all, and doesn't have any malice. But the quote from Gurdjieff in my sig sums things up, I think.
I emailed this morning (10:30) saying I'll come in tomorrow at 1130 to get my pictures and pay for the underbilling. At 230, she emailed back saying she now has that slot filled (which wasn't filled as of last night since she offered it), and I can come at my regular time, Friday. I said I am coming at 1230 between her sessions tomorrow then. Even what she's doing here feels like an abuse of power to let me know I have no say or control with this stuff, she does. But, since she offered 1130-1230 last night, and now has that filled, and since she mentioned she has a client at 100 tomorrow, she should have no reason for me to not be able to come and take the five minutes dealing with this. She hasn't emailed back, but I'm half expecting her to try to stomp on me and tell me that won't work.
This whole thing just feels so ugly. She has just gotten worse and worse once I challenged her. It's like she's being vindictive for me pointing out how she messed up. Maybe it was always this way, and I'm just noticing it now that I've worked up the strength to challenge her.
All this is at the worst time. I don't want to get into it, but I have to go through * on earth this winter. It's been hanging over my head for six years, and I've always planned on dying before it happened. Now I'm three months away from something I've had dozens of people, some really tough ones, say they would just kill themselves if they had to face. Something I tell people and they just get a stunned shocked look on their faces.
Anyhow, about tomorrow. I have to go back! She has my boys, and I need to rescue them!!!
Meursault
Is there a receptionist you could pay and receive the photos from?
This woman is in full-out self-defense mode, which could make her escalate her abusive behaviour. It would be better to not to have any direct contact with her, imo. This is still a situation where she has more power, and you are in a very vulnerable place. Is there someone else who could act as your agent in approaching her, if she is unwilling to post the photos to you?
I recommend giving her any ammunition, and keeping yourself safe while you are feeling in flashback mode. For the meantime, it seems to me there are only two things that matter right now - getting away from an escalating abusive situation, retrieving your property and paying the bill. From this perspective what could help?
It's just a private room rented in an old building with a chair in the hall. I think I should be all right. I only plan to be there for five minutes. It will be hard, but I think avoidance causes me more anxiety in the long run, so I'm better off taking the hit, even if she is hurtful. I may record it on my phone to check later for more detail, since I might be somewhat dissociative.
Thanks everyone for listening and commenting. This stuff is really hard, as many of us know, especially when we are so desperate and hoping it helps, and have been so vulnerable and undefended with the therapist. They have a lot of ammunition to hurt us with! Damned. I spent MONTHS really hoping with her. It's really a lot like a break up...
Meursault
it's very much like a breakup. you've invested time, energy, and money into this relationship. i admire your strength, meursault, and sense of purpose. go get 'em!
Sorry everyone for all the postings...
I'm bawling like crazy right now. Life is SO hard. So t emails back saying she will be too rushed and will leave my pictures under a stack of magazines and void the underbilling.
I went into that SO HOPEFUL. She seemed like such a caring and nice person. I really tried hard the whole time. Now I'm more broken than ever!
In one of my last emails I said: "I look at the positive quotes [from clients] on your website and am left wondering: why didn't I deserve to be treated like that?"
I just don't understand why it's always fine for people to treat me like I don't matter, and then I'm just defective and damaged when I have a problem with it!
In her goodbye email, she gave a list of clinical forensic psychologists, knowing I really have only had success with therapists (MMFT). She knows that I get nowhere with a model that looks at me like this is pathological, rather than what it is, adaptive and natural. It just sends the implicit message that I'm too effed up and need some industrial strength psychologist, none of whom deal with attachment issues well, and are almost entirely skills based in their approach. What helps me is someone I can connect to and feel cares. I don't even know if she intended it, but I feel like she just told me: YOu are too broken for a normal person to help.
And the forensic psychologist angle.... I wasn't going to mention it here, but I killed my Dad in a car accident a few years ago. I was pinned under his corpse for about an hour underwater, straining to take breaths before they got me out. I have a criminal charge over it, and I have the trial this winter. I'm so nonviolent and full of anxiety and have social phobia and have such a horrible self-image to begin with, I'm just going to be victimized if I go to jail. And I'm going to have to relive all that night in court. And all the developmental trauma, and all the trauma from that, and so many other things in my life, and being so alone and unlovable to women etc. And growing up, even my Dad took it out on me, and told me my Mom took it out on him, so he took it out on me, and that'swhat I was there for. But stil, he was he only one relaly n my side growing up. At least there was someone in thenuthouse I grew up in who tought my Mom and sisters were dmented so I wasn't completely alone and there was someone who could make me feel tha IT'S NOT ALL MEthat makes all this stuff happen. And now he's gone because of me, when I was just trying to get him home safe that night.
Everything is just so overwhelming. I really waanted T to help and to care and MATTER t someone. I'm totally going to miss her, even though this stuff happened. I was so hopeful and optimistic that maybe SOMEONE would care about me finally. *, it just felt good to be able to go in and have a nice, attractive woman listen to me and not attack me. But then I suppose it became an attack in a way anways...
Anyhow, I'm bawling like a madman. I've jst been trying so hard for so long and Im so alone!
Meursault
:hug:
You DO matter, dear meursault.
Pick up the pictures and then it's over with her. Don't mail her anymore. Don't read any of her mails anymore.
Your idea of recording your visit on your phone is great.
I really hope that visit will be your last dealings with her, and do I understand she might not even be there? So much the better.
I can relate to the lost hope you now feel. That IS hard. Indeed it's quite like a breakup...
If you can, try to not beat yourself up over this. It's not you, at all.
:hug:
God, I'm so sorry about your Dad and everything you've been through. I can only imagine how frightened you must feel about the upcoming trial. It is appalling that any therapist would treat a client in your position the way you've been treated. I wish there was something I could do to help.
You've come through all of this with all of your humanity and sensitivity intact. Please try and imagine what an achievement that is. Your therapist is just another dumb schmuck with no excuse, and probably without the integrity to ever understand anything beyond the end of her nose. You accidentally became a threat to her overblown opinion of herself, ironically because you are learning and growing. A healthy therapist would do cartwheels with joy that you were able to recognise disrespect and respond appropriately. Instead, she lashed-out. You outgrew her.
You are not too broken, she was too inept, immature and egotistical. There will be someone else who has the wisdom and integrity to really be with you, and guide you while you heal.
You are not crazy and you are not crying alone :hug:
I wish I could physically look you in the eyes and tell you, "You matter to me." And you could see in my eyes, on my face, that I meant it. It's horrible, the things you've been through, and yes you're in pain now - but I firmly believe it's not permanent.
You are meant to be here, not just on the forum but in the world. You are worthy of love and respect and esteem. We are not our mistakes. We are just humans - imperfect, fallible, and trying to find our way.
U'm still all crying. I called a crisis line and talked. Thanks for what evryone is saying here. God, I wish my life could just get better. How awesome it would be if I had a wifew and kids and all that.
It's weird. When someone says something negative about T I want to defend her and I feel bad for her. I want to say: She's actually really nice and caring and just messed up with me! It's like it's my fault that someone would think negatively about her and that makes me bad, because I'm just a piece of s*t male and she's great. How dumb. I don't understand how this is working in my brain. Everything confuses me right now. I actually feel like I've gone kind of crazy. I know she didn't treat me very respectfully, but it's my fault basically I guess, so she can't be blamed. She was actually trying to help someone as hideous and broken as me. She was so good for putting up with me as long as she did...IT'S ALL MY FAULT! Then I also think: she screwed up and didn't have the professionalism to handle it. She should have treated me better. I'm just confused and the complexity of what's happening to me right now is really causing a lot of panic and incoherence in my brain. I feel tons of guilt when someone says she sucks though. I don't get it.
I really think I need to be in a hospital now, but they don't really help. You mostly just get warehoused. The only thing they really offer is meds, and that's not what I need. I'm definitely having a bad night. Also a bad half century, but who's counting!
That'sit! I putting my foot down. Some ofg the little boys in me really need their sleep!
Meursault
Ok. So I went and retrieved my pictures from outside her office. I stood out on the street after and looked at them and cried a bit. I decided to have as much class as possible with this so I got a "thank you" card, put the payment for the half hour she said she'd just void, and wrote this:
Hi [T],
I really wish we'd been able to make that work. I was so optimistic and hopeful with you for quite a while. I hope you don't feel bad at all. There's just something fundamentally wrong with me. I was really trying to find some way to recover from this, too, but you have become so unpredictable and scary to me.
Anyhow, I think you're a really nice person, and your enthusiasm and insight really helped me feel like maybe I mattered! I hope you don't feel bad about how this went! I was really feeling like you cared and understood me, so I have that experience for a while at least. I've included payment for the half hour, too. I don't feel right not paying.
I wish we could have figured a way through this! Thanks for trying with me,
[Meursault]
I don't know, I think it's classier and a more mature thing to do than just skulking away...
The End!
Meursault