Accepting Myself

[Armee]

Yes, very good job putting up a boundary on the no show. Sucks about the loss of income though and waste effort.

You don't have to explicitly tell your exfriend she's an exfriend if you don't want to or feel up to it. She is still an exfriend because she made herself one by how she treated you.

[Blueberry]

Thanks CactusFlower and Armee It's so obviously the correct decision - telling that student to get lost. I used to try harder to retain customers and then everything would just get worse.

I think I do want to tell ex-friend that it's the end of our friendship because of her son being my godson. Without my godmother role, our friendship would have completely fizzled out a while ago imho. I think it's important that she knows that our upcoming communication will be about preserving my role in his life rather than me having any interest in her life. Obviously for his sake it would be good for his mother and I not to turn into total enemies. In the country and culture I live in you make a distinction between friends and acquaintances and she has definitely moved down into the aquaintance category for me. For me, not saying so is sticking to this unhelpful activity: "Dismissing and diminishing your lived experiences and attendant feelings to make other people comfortable in order to preserve relationships with them." (From an article on Psychology Today linked by Hope https://cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=14697.msg120138#new )  Even if it might not look like I'm trying to preserve a relationship with her, deep down it actually has to do with fear in saying what I think and feel. Fear that it might annoy her, fear that I'm coming with it at the wrong time for her and behind all that is childhood experiences with my M. Those experiences are so bad that my body is going numb while I relate this and I can see M in my head. 

At least that is useful now in telling me how important it indeed is to make this step. My T said last appointment that it's possible in inpatient stay that they may do emdr or some other method on specific incidents from my childhood/teen years but the most important for me is to accept myself and be accepted in relationship with whoever, including T, doc etc, instead of people close to me thinking they can be judgemental and still friends or judgemental and still a helpful T /doc.

I'm finally giving my furbaby some of her proper medical care. Today I went for an evening walk about town with a friend and yesterday I took part in a ZOOM social meet-up of a local group I'm a mbr of. That was quite fun, I felt quite lively. I also spoke to the mother of one of my school students about impending inpatient stay and not being able to teach for a while. It turned out easier than I had expected. Otherwise I'm pretty much drifting along and not getting on with much. Although there are some things I really really need to set in motion before I go to inpatient place.

[Blueberry]

So, finally sent that email to GS's mother, ex-friend. Took 2 hours to write. I do have this fear that she will remove GS from my life. I don't actually think she will, the fear is based on my past. But I have said that sort of thing before re: friends and FOO and then it has turned out that they went and reacted the way I feared. On ex-friend's head it would be if she did so.

Spent day reading and dozing in bed. Got up at some point to bring in the mail. Medical insurance has decided to pay 3 weeks inpatient stay    It's not enough but I hope the clinic will accept it and take up the struggle for extending my stay once I'm there. Need to speak to clinic tomorrow. I will of course tell you all before I go.

[rainydiary]

I hope that the outcome of the email and the planning/financials for the inpatient stay are supportive for you.

[dollyvee]

No longer-friend no. 1 hasn't apologised for anything or offered to look at anything or change. It's more like now she realises I mean business, she's using the old donkey-and-carrot trick to attempt to protract the discussion.
[/quote]

Hi Blueberry,

Am catching up on your journal now. I can relate to how difficult the experiences you're going through right now are and find myself in a similar "daze" with reactions of maybe I'm the difficult one etc. I see the struggle you're going through. When I saw the above it came to mind that perhaps you could write her back, reinforcing the boundary you already set. Something like I understand you feel that way but I feel like this about our friendship and don't feel respected by you when you do this etc. I've done that with someone who had a habit of not treating me great in the past and they went into meltdown about how I was always negative and saying they were a horrible person etc, which maybe ultimately made me feel worse (even though I don't think those things were true). On the other hand, I know how hard it is to let sleeping dogs lie and just move on without closure. I think over time, I'm seeing that that's something I can work on myself. Like San said, you may grow to see what they're effects on your life were not great and they weren't a "friend" after all but it's so hard not to internalize that.

***edit*** have just read that you've done that. I hope it doesn't go the way you fear but no matter what, you have to do those things for you. If she takes it a certain way despite your best efforts to explain, that's on her.

Ha! Now I'm going to have to search the forum for a toxic friend thread because if there isn't one there should be where we can all share war stories.

dolly 

[Blueberry]

Ex-friend no.2 has not removed GS from my life. She did thank me for my hard and hurtful words though. I replied that her words to me were also very hurtful and some of her attitudes non-negotiable. Trying to argue FOR my parents - non-negotiable.

I felt bad afterwards and also sad. I felt bad because I was wondering if I wasn't like FOO - arguing for the sake of it and not getting to the real feelings?? Or arguing over words and the intentions they spelled out without delving underneath. These were things I wondered yesterday but today I think I am expecting too much of myself, expecting myself to somehow be the bigger person who understands more and knows how to interpret what this person really means. I see M in my head now. She often interpreted what I really meant to other people e.g. F in the middle of arguments and was totally wrong. Ex-friend no.2 shored up her arguments so to speak and wrote things she's written before like she assumed our friendship had been long and good enough so far to handle her real thoughts on my actions and attitudes to third-parties (e.g. my parents and ex-friend no.1). Well, I guess she has finally understood that that's not the case. And that it is too late.

I know people are sometimes shocked at my unforgiving attitude, that I have said before at the end of friendships  - it is too late. However, ex-friend no.2 shores up her arguments but at no point does she say e.g. "this is what I believed, obviously I was wrong, sorry I hurt you" there are just more and more reasons why what I said/did lead her to believe and say what she did or why she's that way in general. I told her e.g. that her and her H's fat-shaming was hurtful to me. She wrote back that H doesn't mean any harm and that she tries to temper it a bit when he gets like that but obviously she hadn't managed and also in difficult situations (she doesn't elaborate what those are, maybe she means the pandemic but actually the fat-shaming was BEFORE the pandemic) they both lean towards non-PC humour to deal with life. So, no 'sorry', no 'I have no control over H but I'll try not to join in with him another time', no 'I can see how our behaviour in this respect teaches GS hurtful ways of being and acting' (which I had alluded to). Just one example of many. She also says I could have told her I disagreed with decisions she made without remembering that we had discussed various, that I had said I disagreed or I objected to the repercussions for me. So I feel I'm being blamed in retrospect for not saying 'No!' loudly enough or for in fact compromising and now deciding to no longer compromise to that degree.

It's hard for me to accept the percussions of all this, but this is what happens when I don't try as long and as hard with people as I did with FOO. I have learnt to give up earlier. It's difficult, it makes me sad that I'm giving up earlier but I can almost think and say that it's the correct decision. Almost. There are I think societal barriers to giving up. Or maybe those are just societal barriers in my own head or societal barriers I learned before I was in trauma-informed therapy. Pre-trauma-informed therapy I learned to question and even condemn just about every action I took. You can't change other people, you can only change yourself (true) but the changes I was often nudged and even pushed toward were 'understanding' where the other person was coming from and not saying "No!!". I was seen as being too hard on others without there being some understanding as to where this hardness comes from. My present T spent so much time teaching me that "No" is not impolite and it is not necessarily unfriendly. I suppose you could say he has spent a lot of time teaching me that it is perfectly OK not to enable others to go over my boundaries. Whereas in the past therapists were quibbling with me about how I set those boundaries, not realising or caring that the most important thing for me was setting them and having them accepted by those who think they are close to me and that when that has happened enough, then compromise and maybe a gentler way of setting could occur. But the compromise is only for the people I'm dealing with. So that doesn't mean I'll compromise with ex-friend no.2 on how I deal with my parents, obviously, I would have thought. But that doesn't seem obvious to her. Anyway, just working some things out in my head and feelings.

[rainydiary]

Blueberry, I appreciate your reflections on this and have been thinking a lot about the ending of friendships.  It is confusing to me that friends come and go and yet we are not static beings so it does make sense that our friendship/relationship needs would change.  I am with you that establishing boundaries with people earlier than we may have in the past is needed.  I also don't think that just because someone has known us for a long time means they can say whatever they want to us.  I appreciate the work you are doing as it helps me consider how this could look in my life.  It is so difficult and it can hurt. 

[dollyvee]

Hi Blueberry,

I think those things would be very hurtful to hear and it seems understandable that a friend would recognize how/why you might be upset about that. I think you also have a right to change your mind about something and say after reflecting on it, you do find the remarks unacceptable. The boundaries might seem new but I would say you have every right for setting them. It is hard when other people don't recognize it though,

I had (another!) friend do something similar I think where she was going behind my back and basically gossiping about me. At the time she brushed it off as something normal. I felt very much like an outcast with my friends for sticking up about it. Over the years though, this person has just become more selfish and managed to alienate a lot of people. Sometimes it takes time to see you did the right thing and the wait isn't usually easy.

Hope find some space to be with this,
dolly 

[Blueberry]

Thanks rainydiary and dolly for reading and commenting.

Boomerang of sadness this afternoon about end of friendship with ex-friend no.2 and what that all means, so yes, dolly I did have space for it With the sadness, some questioning of my own actions in all this but a lot less ICr. than usual. Who wants to feel sad? But still here I think it was good to feel those feelings. Because mourning an end of a friendship can include all feelings. Hurt and anger I've felt and still feel. Now sadness.

Dolly, I think I manage to alienate a lot of people too, e.g. with my hardness. Though there have been people over the years who recognise different things hidden under the hardness e.g. pain but also a friendly, genuinely helpful person, kindness, willingness to look at my own shortcomings, honesty (including brutal honesty about myself and those shortcomings), loyalty. Some people even see/feel/sense a loving person under all that.

The wait to see I did the right thing isn't usually easy - it's genuinely good to know that Dolly. Makes sense of course.

[Hope67]

Hi Blueberry,
I read what you wrote, and I felt sadness.  I think I needed to feel it, and was glad to have felt it.  I just wanted to send you a hug of support, and say that I feel sadness along side you.  Different things, but a shared feeling.  Hope it was ok to say that.
Hope 

[dollyvee]

Hi Blueberry,

That's great that you have room for this and have less icr than usual. Something came to mind reading your earlier comment about wondering if you're like your parents and how they respond and that you're probably not like them (because you're reflecting on your behaviour). I think for us there's no road map (boundary map) about what the correct response is. We go into this nether region of questioning ourselves and did I do the right thing or not, was it me, am I like this, a bad person etc? I know I look for validation from other people where a lot of others would have probably just thought that's their stuff, let me move on. You're trying to work out your boundaries and maybe you are overprotective at times because they're new, but it also seems like that's something you're aware of and have made an effort to understand someone else's pov when they haven't tried to understand yours. I think that shows you're not an inflexible person. Maybe when other people begin to respect your boundaries, you'll feel safer in how you react when people step over them.

dolly

[CactusFlower]

Maybe when other people begin to respect your boundaries, you'll feel safer in how you react when people step over them.

Couldn't have said it better. Not to mention, you'll have better examples of what it means to actually have your boundaries respected.

[Blueberry]

Maybe when other people begin to respect your boundaries, you'll feel safer in how you react when people step over them.

Couldn't have said it better. Not to mention, you'll have better examples of what it means to actually have your boundaries respected.

Thank you CactusFlower and dolly - those are really good thoughts and really helpful new stages of recovery for me to look forward to! It also makes sense that we have no road map of boundaries in place to fall back on so we end up slithering around the place looking for validation.

People like ex-friend no.2 undoubtedly used to sense me looking for validation 'all the time'. Last year when things went awry, it was partly because - I guess - she didn't notice that I was no longer looking for validation. I was saying: 'this is how it is for me.' But possibly my voice or my general demeanor was still a bit tentative or something, so she leapt in with de-validation. Not validating is OK, people don't have to agree with me. But the absolute opposite e.g. validating my parents to me or arguing the part of another friend who is not respecting my boundaries and not even remotely willing to look at her part in this?? No. Sorry. No way. It is really difficult though and needs practice. Needs to be put into use until I have a better road map to fall back on!   Also needs practice around people who are willing to respect me as an adult just-like-them, not as some person who has no mind and no feelings and no judgement who can be pushed around to see it another person's way. (Just putting it in different words for myself.)

I am accepting myself better with and after these sorts of steps. Yes, ICr. pops up but not as loudly or as virulently as a few months ago. There's also been a big change in the length of time ICr. hangs about spreading poison in my head and feelings - the length of time is much shorter! Sometimes just a day. That could certainly be because I don't have so many 'friends' working like ICr. for me. Who needs friends who emulate ICr.??

I finally wrote a response to ex-friend no.1 partially because I still need to get something important back from her and give her something in return. Letter boxes will do, we don't need to meet in person.

Hope, it's good to see you back on the forum. I'm glad Kizzie was able to help you. Thank you for your hug of support. It's fine by me that you wrote that you felt sadness too, even if it was for a different reason. It's still validating that we can both feel sadness, where in earlier times on this forum I had a lot of trouble feeling emotions and sitting with them and you had trouble writing about them. So yesterday we were standing together in sadness but also in our healing progress. 

[CactusFlower]

   Sounds great that your ICr is lessening! I think you really nailed why, that the critic isn't being fed from the outside.

[Blueberry]

Thank you CactusFlower! It probably really does have to do with the lack of feed coming to ICr from outside.

Self-care very bad atm - waiting to go inpatient basically, although I know that if I got my self-care etc back in place I'd be able to move on recovery itself so much faster when I finally go inpatient. Knowing and doing are two separate things however. Possibly I need to look more at what it is that I am accomplishing atm. Things like the above: reducing contact with other people's OCr. attacks on me, (completely) reducing contact with people who do me psychological/emotional harm, deciding the harm these people are doing to me overrules any good they do or did.
Then realising: this is really difficult, it makes for a period of mourning. It's also brave! It takes courage to turn your back on people you thought were friends, people who still think they are friends. And to do so before you have a new set of friends in place.

Somebody looking at my life from outside rn would probably say I'm lonely, at best. I have basically been alone this weekend so far and don't have any 'fun' planned, but part of me was feeling very much at peace today. Maybe at peace to start turning into who I am without ICr.?