I've bought the book: "Treating Trauma-Related Dissociation: A Practical, Integrative Approach" by Kathy Steele, Suzette Boon and Onno Van Der Hart - it is the 2017 edition.
I hope to write a few notes from the book as I read it - I would invite anyone who wants to contribute their own comments etc to do so.
My thoughts about the book are - it is a really well put-together book - the titles of the chapters are really relevant, and I have read Chapter 1 - and found it very helpful so far.
Chapter 1: Dissociation as Non-Realisation
I relate to p.6 "Though patients may talk as if they have insight and have integrated trauma, often this superficial and unemotional narrative is an avoidance accompanied by dissociation and depersonalization"
I really relate to this - I think I feel emotionless many times, but there are 'waves of emotion' for me within instances - there are delays in my processing - I think I do avoid - I barely process some things, and maybe over-focus on other things.
p.7 "Each dissociative part of the patient's personality encompasses a unique perception of reality that can contradict the reality of other parts, with an amazing attitude of indifference toward profound inconsistencies"
This also makes sense to me.
The conclusion from p.8 that "the division of self is a solution to unbearable and irreconcilable realities' - that also makes sense.
Something that has meaning is on p.11 where it says "AS these young parts, the patient avoids the realization that sh eis now grown-up and must grieve what she did not receive in childhood."
p.13
"Some have a hyper-activated care-giving system, which is commonly referred to as codependence" - I didn't think of this possible definition of codependence, but I think I have this - it relates to my experience for definite.
I also really related to the description of Helen on p.17 where it says about Helen "Helen, a child who was smart and competent in school and functioned in daily life, but who avoided thinking or knowing about the abuse. Later, Helen only has the most fragmentary recall of childhood." I feel like that describes me for a large part of my life - it was like my memories colluded to block out the bad parts - trivialised them, minimised them, fragmented them. The book goes into details about the different parts of Helen, and I relate to the descriptions there. I won't repeat them as I think it's potentially too triggering to do so, but I really relate to all that is said there.
(I wasn't sure whether to start my notes about this book here or not - I know there was a group of people who had worked through an older edition of this book, and I was trying to find that section, and couldn't find it - so I have started here - but maybe it's ok for me to write here? I don't want to do the wrong thing, I feel a bit unsure whether it's ok to do this note-taking in this way, but I do find it helpful, and I re-read it - plus any comments people make. Anyway, I think I'll stop for now - so far I have read Chapter 1 in its entirety - and written these notes up to p.19 - so I hope to continue.
But I'll take a break now.
Hope :)
I had started to go through this book, starting with Chapter 1 - and make some notes here, but I want to update and say that I've found it too difficult to share my notes in this part - because I've ended up reading further and now I'm on p.174, which is actually Chapter 8 - and whilst there have been many insights that I've gained from reading the chapters, I am finding it's very hard to process everything - and so I've cut myself some slack and decided to just write as and when I can and want to - rather than trying to be more 'structured' - I think sometimes I end up feeling like I'm doing some sort of homework - not sure why - it just seems to happen.
Also, the fact is, I think I go 'too fast' - reading different books, but it's like I'm keen to learn and keen to finally be able to work out things in my life - because it's like the key is there and I can finally unlock some doors. So I feel like I need to chase and identify triggers, and explore, and recognise the parts that are reluctant for me to do that, and the parts that are keen for me to attach and do things.
Anyway, I just wanted to say that I'll hope to pop back and write some things about this book here - but probably not in the structured way I'd tried to do with other books. I don't like to start something and then not see it through, and I'm not giving up on it, I'm just allowing myself to process things at the pace I need and looking out for my needs - which is a good thing. (Internally I felt like I was getting some kind of rapid heart-rate- which is weird, that hasn't happened before) - just noting that, as it was like an inner part of me was anxious about this.
Hope :)
Sometimes we do, as you point out, let our eagerness to share insights we come across too quickly, often before or while we're digesting the material. Then, as you say, it becomes like homework.
I do enjoy your insights with your reads, and I also recognize that desire to get the word out, to hit all the salient points that lit up the sky, so to speak. I also tend to rush my reading in this way. It's almost like I'm so eager to reach the essential (and perfect!) statement that's going to fix my problem and I'll live happily ever after.
So I find myself needing to slow down, absorb better, and just follow what's being said (or not said in some instances). Plus, if it's germane to where we feel we need to get, there's almost a hidden back of the mind panic that sets in, a perfectionist slant I guess. I call this the I-just-have-to-get-this-right syndrome, followed by the someday-I'll-get-this-perfect one.
Then again, learning was always my passion, followed by sharing, but balanced by just being. I sense this might be how it works for you too. It's not so much a fault as a means by which we try to make sense of this craziness. It's just that occasionally the balance gets confusing. Still knowledge is a great thing, so keep it up :thumbup:
Hey Hope67
I purchased this book a couple of months ago, read it within days. Thought "I can do this".
And then discovered it was harder than I though. Haven't picked it back up again for a while, re-doing parts of Pete Walkers book.
I recently bought this book as well, I've read chpts 1 & 2 , if it's ok I can talk thru things as well while going thru it
Hi Woodsgnome - I found it very helpful to read about how you also find that you might rush your reading in a similar way to how I have done - and acknowledging the need to slow down, absorb better etc - I also recognise a perfectionist streak in me - and in parts of me - and like you - I also feel that 'learning' is a passion - I love knowledge and learning, and my life has been centred around that from the start - I totally appreciate your thumb's up, and your encouragement, and I appreciate your support - thankyou so much :hug:
Hi Boy22 - It is a massive book with so much information, and it's also more complicated than I envisaged - and I appreciate you saying how you felt it was harder than you thought - I am on Chapter 8 now - and I will be no doubt re-reading it when I get to the end, and also dipping into the other books I have - I've read Pete Walker's books a couple of times - and I will also go back to them - I find I get more out of a book on a second or even third reading, but it's probably because different parts of me absorb different bits, or maybe I don't even absorb the same bits each time - but what I have noticed is that I am absorbing something - and I feel things are going in a 'direction' - that feels good. Boy22 - I hope the same for you, and I hope that we'll be able to say 'We can do this' in terms of making some progress with things.
Hi Wattlebird - I knew that someone else had purchased this book recently, and somehow I couldn't recall who it was, but I think it was probably you - as I think you have mentioned it some other time - and I am so glad that you are reading it, and I hope you and anyone who is reading it will feel free to write in this thread, or in another one, if you prefer, but I would welcome the chance to talk through things in this thread - about this book - and anything related to that - that's for sure! Somewhere in the forum, there is a whole set of people who read the previous edition of the same book, and they had gone through it and discussed it - and I also hope to find that and read through what they said, as I think it would be really helpful.
I feel so happy that this forum is here and we can talk about things - and share experiences of books and articles and anything else here - it's really positive.
Hope :)
Thanks hope the previous discussion on this book is archived kizzie gave it to me
Here's the link
http://cptsd.org/forum/index.php?board=195.0
Enjoy
I read chpt 3 it talks of recognising parts of your self - I strongly related to the parts described except the inner helper helping parts get along, I was going to work on recognising young parts but there is so much inner resistance that I may just read on for now not push, I'm intrigued by this concept of self I relate and understand it intuitively, thank goodness
Hi Wattlebird
I thought I was doing great at getting all my parts together is a safe place until I realised my inner child sat mute thinking, "nup, you're and adult and I don't trust adults, besides you've been around when they've hurt me before and did nothing so why should anything change now?"
Harsh huh?
Yes boy22
Harsh is right, I was a little too confident in my expectations, thought my parts would be happy to cooperate haha
It's really where the work in this book is going to help me recognise these important parts of myself and validate them though and recognising this is the first step in bringing it all together
Hope your doing well in this :hug:
Boy 22 said via the inner child's voice:
"nup, you're and adult and I don't trust adults, besides you've been around when they've hurt me before and did nothing so why should anything change now?"
I just wanted to quickly share how familiar that quote sounded, as it was precisely the same reaction I received when I first (very skeptically) started visiting my inner child's domain.
Encouraged by reading other accounts, I later broke through, and finally succeeded. I wrote this out in story form. Long story short, adult me was going to leave inner child yet again, but relented and just took him with me, right past the abusers (my FOO) in their own house, out the door and good riddance.
Back to the skepticism--it helped to suspend disbelief and just be creative; it's what we have imaginations for. In the end, rescuing the kid was also a meaningful way of feeling that I'd finally beat them at their own game, and that they never knew what happened
Take care, persevere, and who knows what might happen. Sometimes "it's only a story" can provide the ticket past always feeling trapped inside.
Quote from: Wattlebird on October 16, 2018, 10:18:09 AM
I was going to work on recognising young parts but there is so much inner resistance that I may just read on for now not push, I'm intrigued by this concept of self I relate and understand it intuitively, thank goodness
Hi Wattlebird - thank you for including the link above to the archived past discussions of this book - I am hoping to read through those once I've got a bit further in the book - and like you - I'm 'reading on for now' and 'not push'ing - as I think my style with reading a book is to read it to the end, and then try to re-read and process - it's almost like I want to ensure that I'm not going to get anything unexpected - and I think it's also because it's a tough thing to process and read.
I really appreciate the fact we can all share our thoughts and experiences and reflections on things we've read - it means a lot to know we're not alone with these things.
Hope :)
Quote from: Boy22 on October 16, 2018, 05:49:14 PM
Harsh huh?
Hi Boy22 - I think that is 'harsh' and I'm glad you're here - and I really think that what Woodsgnome said - it makes sense - and I'm encouraged by what Woodsgnome also said about being able to break through and succeed finally - let's hope we can all do that - and get to where we want to be.
Hope :)
Quote from: woodsgnome on October 17, 2018, 01:09:13 AM
Take care, persevere, and who knows what might happen. Sometimes "it's only a story" can provide the ticket past always feeling trapped inside.
Hi Woodsgnome, I am encouraged by your words here - very much so.
Hope :)
Quote from: Hope67 on October 21, 2018, 05:53:51 PM
Quote from: Boy22 on October 16, 2018, 05:49:14 PM
Harsh huh?
Hi Boy22 - I think that is 'harsh' and I'm glad you're here - and I really think that what Woodsgnome said - it makes sense - and I'm encouraged by what Woodsgnome also said about being able to break through and succeed finally - let's hope we can all do that - and get to where we want to be.
Hope :)
I too liked and appreciated Woodsgome's words.
He, you, the whole community make this place wonderful.
I agree Boy22 that this is a wonderful community. :grouphug:
Hope :)
I've read the first 13 chapters, I especially appreciated chpt 8 talked about developing an inner sense of safety, my t was also talking about being more compassionate with my parts so I have been working on that while reading on, I am reading through end to end and then going back and working thru each stage (good idea hope It suits me perfectly )
Chapter 14 talks of traumatic memories and triggers I read part of the chpt and took a break, I just wanted to touch base here and encourage you to keep up your work as well :applause:
Hi Wattlebird,
I am so happy that you are reading this book - it feels like you're a companion along the journey - I appreciate you touching base here and also sending encouraging words - and I want to also wish you encouragement in return. I think you're very sensible to pace yourself in the way you're doing - I have been trying to do the same thing - it's been quite over-whelming on occasions - infact a lot of the time, but I am really finding the content of the book to be really useful, and I relate to so much of it. I'm on Chapter 17 at the moment. However, that has been heavy going, and I have a few stressful appointments to attend this week - so I'm going to probably take a bit of a break from the book, and maybe pick it back up on the weekend, or even early next week - depending on how I go.
Good to know we're both feeling that reading through and then going back and working thru each stage - is a good way - sounds positive to me. I'm with you on that plan. Definitely!
Hope :)
Just wanted to say that I've finished reading this book - and am currently allowing my brain to settle and process in the background. However, I do intend to start going through it chapter by chapter - and was wondering if maybe I should start that process in the section called 'Book Talk' and head the chapters appropriately - i.e. Chapter 1, then Chapter 2 so that there are separate threads, and then anyone who wanted to 'talk' or 'comment' on the relevant chapter - could do so. I know there are a few of us reading it - i.e. Wattlebird and Boy22 and myself - and maybe others too.
I think we're all on different chapters - so maybe if any of us decide to comment on a chapter - that person could start the Chapter title (if it wasn't already done) - and the rest of us could then write in it.
I don't know - I am just putting this forward as a potential - my inner critic is telling me off for suggesting this - saying I am annoying, but I was just thinking that it would be great to be able to 'talk' about this book - and share our experiences of it.
I'm having a break today - in terms of focusing on relaxing and therefore not planning to do any self-help reading today.
Hope :)
I think that's a great idea, then we can actually have it more organised to follow for late comers, or for different paces, it will be much easier, don't harass yourself it's a good idea
I'm up to chpt 18 I'm struggling a bit more with the talk of emotions, so I'm going slow as I'm struggling a lot with this subject atm, given current circumstances but I still am keen to work thru it all
Hi Wattlebird,
That's great that you like the Book Talk suggestion - I am gearing up to starting with Chapter 1 again soon. I know I've been avoiding a bit - but maybe I can phrase that in terms of pacing myself better. I hope you're managing - because I know you said Chapter 18 was emotional - I agree - there are many triggering parts - I find that I have struggled - but like you, I am also keen to work thru it all as well. Good to know we're both reading it and getting something from it.
Hope :)
Hi hope,
I am up to around chpt 27 inner child stuff, I found this chpt hard going, but I'm getting there, keep finding myself dwelling on crapola and not actually taking in what I'm reading. So I do small chunks, most of the chapters I'm fine with though. So I might read 3 chapters one day and then take 3 days to read another chapter but I'm not pushing myself too much which is nice.
Ow it's only chapter 25
Hi Wattlebird - I think you're doing really well - you're pacing things and not pushing yourself too much - and I think that's really sensible. I just tried to work out whether I could add to the 'Book Talk' section - but it wasn't as easy as I thought it might be. I saw there is already a section about the book 'Coping with Trauma-Related Dissociation' - which I think was the earlier edition of the book we're reading?
I was going to start a title of Chapter 1 of 'Treating Trauma-Related Dissociation' by Kathy Steele, Suzette Boon & Onno Van der Hart (2017 edition) - as I re-read it today and was thinking of reflections to say. For some reason I can't seem to work out how to put it in 'Book Talk' - maybe I should put it in this section - in a new thread? I don't know.
Anyway, I wonder if my inability to work this out is down to my being a bit phobic about writing about my parts - I know some of them are more keen for me to do that, and other parts aren't so keen. I realise a conflict there already - but I really valued re-reading Chapter 1 today - I found it much more emotional than I did before - I think I might be processing things more.
Wattlebird - I just wanted you to know I am hoping to write Chapter 1 as a heading - once I work out where best to put it and how to do it. Good luck with your reading - I think it's a great book.
Hope :)
Hi hope I can start the thread in book talk if u want but I understand if you want to do it as well, I'm in the last section about relationships, I really related to the decision making section, I felt like showing my hubby what goes on when I need to make decisions but then thought maybe I'd be wiser not to show him, he might just decide I'm too crazy after all.
I liked your letter to your parts, maybe make an agreement with your parts that if all parts don't want to share something you won't share it, then they may be less defensive, and won't be working against you. Not sure if it will help but just saw the inner conflict your having, I am also very cerebral about all this stuff, hence the stumbling block at emotions, but we are working on that in therapy. Your doing well Hope keep up the good work.
Hi Wattlebird,
I've just read your reply here, and I've only just posted my attempt at Chapter 1 - it is here:
http://cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=11206.0
I have no idea if it's the right place, it appears in the Book Talk - underneath it - I woke up this morning and was feeling like I wanted to 'do it' - so it's done! At least we have Chapter 1 now, and basically we can start the new chapters as and when we want to - i.e. you or I, or anyone else who wants to - I appreciate you offering to do it today - I was struggling yesterday! I feel sure it was resistance on behalf of some of my parts, but thankfully today - I was just able to do it.
I really like your suggestion to make an agreement with my parts - I will think about that and hope to do that. Thank you!
I am really happy you're doing this too.
Hope :)
Thanks hope
Good going, I will have a look at the link when I'm done, 1.5 chapters to go and easy subjects for me, well not too hard I should say.
Good going to you too, Wattlebird.
Hope :)
Hi hope
I've got an older edition and the chapters are different, of course I've been struggling with this dilemma, eye roll, not sure what to do wether to contribute on your thread or just :Idunno: not sure how different it will be
Hi Wattlebird,
I didn't realise the editions were all different like that (i.e. different chapter titles etc) - I don't know what to suggest - I would say do whatever feels ok for yourself - that's the main thing - in anycase, I will keep an eye out for any of your posts, as we are looking at the same issues - and so I will hope to read what you write. I wonder if your edition is the same one as the others were discussing in the previous Book talk - the title looks different and the order that the authors are listed was different too.
Whatever you do, I wish you the best with all of it - and as I said, I'll keep a look out for your posts as well.
Hope :)
I've been having a busy time lately. I have been reading many of the posts on the forum but saying little.
Hope, I enjoyed your summary of chapter one in your book. It made me want to go back and re-read mine again as I haven't touched it in some time.
Guess what, I have a first edition. Its chapter one is dry and boring. Never mind.
Hope, please continue with your new thread for each chapter in your book. I really look forward to that and to reading many of your other posts, forgive me for not replying but I am there along side you (&WattleBird).
Hi Boy22,
You have a first edition - wow. Sorry that it's Chapter 1 is dry and boring though. Yes, I am definitely going to try to continue with a new thread for each chapter of the book - because I am finding it helpful and am glad to know that you and Wattlebird and others are finding it helpful too - I feel much more supported in this than in the past - as I would have been reading self-help books by myself and not being able to talk about it at all - and now I can interact with people who understand, and it's frankly amazing to be able to do that. Like a new lease of life - honestly.
I am also alongside you - and Wattlebird, and also others here - my virtual family - that's how it feels :grouphug:
One of my inners isn't happy about my saying that, but many of my innners feel that - so I am saying it. :)
Hope :)